why dream? just do that now. if you fail, do programming again.

Fake it until you make it.

> I made a mistake in trying to chase the startup dream.

Its only a mistake if you didn't learn from it.

Do not feel defeated. You seem to have the necessary skills and knowledge. You can do this. Sell yourself.

Source of experience: 15 years of tech experience

Exactly. If your ideas aren't working right now, why not work on some other guy's?

I can see that you're willing to let someone else handle all the business side. So why not not join some start up that you believe in, and provide your tech skills to help realize their dream. In the mean time you can learn how they did the business side. This will also alleviate you from your financial troubles (though do you really have them? considering your $5000...)

And then some time in the future, someone will provide their business skills to help realize your dream.

Either way, it's time to get a job.

> go bang your girlfriend and give her a massage.

Yep, she deserves that for sticking with you through all this.

I feel like you have the beginnings of an entrepreneur here. You should start something that solves this problem you're seeing. The last 2 people I've heard make similar comments ended up starting their own tech-consulting firm. :)

1. "Hate it when X becomes Y and you actually just wanted Z"?

2. "Make an app or start a company that can assure people that X will become Z as quickly and painlessly as possible"

3. ??? (Something to do with YC).

4. "Become a millionaire"

Even if you can, you shouldn't expend a non-trivial amount of brain cycles on that, especially early on.

> If on the other hand you're experienced it's probably about finding that trade off between perfectly orchestrated software and having something that delivers your vision in an acceptable amount of time.

Don't.

As someone who built (and sold) a business before and is building a new one, I'd say it really doesn't matter before you get traction. Just ship the damn thing however you can!

The chance of a first-time founder succeeding is incredibly slim anyway. So, you're better off spending your time figuring out distribution and finding a good enough market.

Yes I have.

>>Most people are not supportive, including developers. You might even lose friends over it. You are going against the norm and most people can't relate and find it strange.

Software is one of the few industries where leaving a stable job and striking out on your own is an acceptable and relatable career path. The reasons are two-fold: low cost of entry and the many inspirational and well-publicized stories about famous software startups. Google, Apple, Microsoft, Facebook... any developer who has been in the industry for more than a few years will be familiar with how those companies got founded.

All of my friends were supportive when I started my own business. Not everyone approved, but they all understood. If you've lost friends when you started yours... maybe you should pick better friends next time.

Do it as a solopreneur/indie hacker. If you have a job you gotta do the job, not what you want

What do you believe in? Have you thought much on this? If you haven’t I’d recommend it. Introspection and mindfulness can really help you suss our what _you want_ from your career and life in general.

I’m with you on general disillusionment with the tech “industry” as you’ve posed it, but really that’s only part of the picture. There are still people on the fringes doing some pretty cutting edge work. It’s not where the big money is, but is much more engineering focused.

Regardless it’s worth double checking your assumption that you should completely strike out on your own. Chances are if you think about what you believe in, you’ll arrive at what you want, and from there you’ll find people with similar goals working on interesting projects.

Feel free to email me if you’d like to discuss. I’ve gone through a very similar “crisis” recently.

Sounds impulsive, but doesn't have to be. It's possible to make that jump after long and thorough consideration. It took me years and a couple of jobs before I finally dared to quit and start my own thing. Not everything I did with my own thing worked out well; spent a lot of time finding my own way, wasted a lot of time, made almost no money in my first year. I did some freelance work, now working on a bigger freelance gig, but I'm really hitting my stride now, and can't wait to go back to my own projects.

I'm not a natural entrepreneur. It took me ages to make this step. Nobody in my extended family has their own company; they all work for a salary. Nobody likes this kind of risk, but I love it. I love the freedom and the uncertainty. I love the risk.

It was a tough decision, and it still seems impulsive compared to a steady salary, but it was the second best decision of my life. (The best was marrying my wife, but that one was surprisingly easy.)

Next line

> But for me, I can't take it anymore.

How can you advice something you're not doing?

I don't question you have worked really hard and pushed yourself to the limit, but I would look at the experience you've gained as a learning experience and seeing things from different perspective when you get a job. Now you will see in more clarity why decisions are made at work, and how hard it is to sell a product.

Celebrate your learnings, your situation is the majority, very few startups will succeed.

This is probably the biggest factor (money is the least). I've had numerous failed projects. I have a current project/business (it's in my profile) which I believe to be in the process of failing. I don't know if I have another one in me.

Sure, I've learned a lot. From a purely technical standpoint, each new project has been superior to the one before - and in the case of my latest, I've at least produced something that I find useful. But, the ego can only take so much abuse.

Not sure I trust myself with ideas anymore. I need someone to tell me what to build :)

I didn't say it was, and I don't expect me to become a billionaire either.

To be quite honest, I find the startup culture of 1. Write tiny hack, 2. Get acquired for billions to be completely weird and wholly unsustainable.

I just code because I like coding. If someone is lucky and gets rich in the process, good for them I guess.

I wish I could have told this to my wife when we were 22!

"I'm sorry, babe! You need to pay the bills and support me while I work to get my startup off-the-ground! You'll see! We'll be raking in the money in no-time. Our 130K of student loan debt will be paid off before you can say `boo'."

</sarcasm>

Would that be the VC-raising industry? Because there are many web startups out there that have had no such experiences, have avoided VC and chosen to simply grow slowly, happily and by investing the founder's time and energy rather than other (often highly dubious) people's money.

Don't be depressed because some fools are handing out millions to other fools, you don't need to compete with that. All that counts is your product.

You assume incorrectly. I am not rich by the standards of rich people (although I am rich by the standards of many others, but I think it's safe to say that most of the people reading my comment right now are wealthier than me), and I don't form startups because of a desire to gain wealth. I have no actual interest in amassing wealth as such.

I form startups because they give me the opportunity and freedom to engage in projects that deeply interest me.

Working at a startup you can also do very well for yourself.

Yep.

> it'll have to be bootstrapped (vc money is just another boss), so the chances for success are extremely low.

Also a lot of VCs are creeps. I've had a mate get pre-emptive death threats from one, another big one in London was found wandering the tube (subway) molesting women.

Bootstrapping is possible. You sound like a dev. I suggest making a minimal SaaS devtools product for something that bothers you.

I bootstrapped a website verification tool for 5 years, it's definitely possible.

If you're in the US, you can join an accelerator.

It's a great idea. Starting a business will open you up to a whole world of new skills. As a programmer, you can probably start something with zero capital, just your free time, so the risks can be generally low. To make it successful, it will eventually become all-consuming, but it doesn't have to be at the start.

I've started two SaaS businesses, one successful, one not, and looking back I still think the most gratifying moment is going from $0 in revenue to $1. Doing that still takes many nights and weekends, but you can still psychologically treat it like a hobby. The emotionally hard part comes after that first dollar, although you should just cross that bridge when you get there.

Happy to chat more about this offline if you're really interested, feel free to lookup my profile and email me.

I don't know why, but comments like this rub me the wrong way. Not that I don't agree that entrepreneurship is extremely difficult, it is!... just that I think people have a way of surviving and developing coping mechanisms for whatever life throws at them.

The fact that you have sleepness nights and puke from the stress tells me that you are not cut out for it.. yet, you are doing it...and without regrets.

Humans have a way of being resilliant.There is only one measure that determines if you are cut out for it or not...and that's if you try and it ends up ruining your life.

This idea that entrepreneurs tell others - that they are not cut out for doing a startup is really just a classic case of putting others down to prop yourself up.

If you want to do a startup, DO IT! Don't let others talk you out of it by convincing you that you aren't cut out for it. Short of a therapist encouraging you to avoid it, I would discount that advice as an insecure founder trying to make himself feel better about coping so poorly.