To make it cheaper, maybe they could just do half the keyboard. Say split it between 5-6, t-y, g-h, and b-n and just make the left half with an OLED screen. The best part is they could then sell you a new MBP in two years which has a full OLED keyboard when the prices have come down.
Back to reality, the problem is that more than 5% of common people use those function key buttons on a daily basis, and they need that haptic feedback. I want my computer's volume, playback and brightness controls to be easily accessible. I also want to be able to use my escape key. I don't want to have to switch to some other application in order to turn the volume down or pause my music when I'm interrupted by someone, and it's nice to be able to control the screen brightness without having to switch applications in order to do so.
I use an external keyboard with my mbp mostly, but I use my escape key more regularly than all my F-keys and the fn/command buttons. I really don't think I'd buy a laptop that was missing what I consider to be a key component like that. I'm sure there's a contextual variant, but there's a pretty big difference between a tactile button and whatever haptic OLED nonsense that Apple put up there.
This might be good for their consumer target audience, but I don't think it's good at all for their main proponents - techies and techie students. I'm very surprised that this issue didn't pop up internally. I wonder about their internal culture if this kind of a design went this far.
Time to make the top row with Esc and function keys as an external keyboard. If didn't Apple already done that, since they're an accessories company lately.
Apple keyboards are miserable. I don't know why people keep saying that it's so wonderful.
I have a Macbook pro I get from work and the keyboard on that thing is borderline unusable. With it's weird flat keys, no travel, and the elimination of function keys for this terrible GUI thing.
As an Emacs user I find the whole concept of a "touch screen esc key" as deplorable and regressive.
And this is on top of the poor reliability and high cost of repair.
This is below baseline. I still don't understand why it's important for them to make compromises at the keyboard, which is an essential part of the notebook experience. A keyboard has keys, keys have a certain height. Get over it Apple. I've tried the latest 3 generations of keyboards and the 2015 still comes out on top. It looks as if Apple's engineers are trying to fight the keyboard. Macbook's keyboard were almost unquestionably the best among notebooks. Now we're happy if they're not crap. Of course this is all personal opinion and I'm sure Apple tests these things extensively and only release them if they make for a significant improvement. They wouldn't release a broken keyboard and deny they're at fault for years, right?
I wonder if Apple gathers any statistics on the most pressed keyboard keys. That could be a reason why they decided to go with the OLED touch panel as a replacement for function keys.
I’m only two months in having been clinging to my 2015 MBP until recently forced to upgrade by my company. Now I feel borderline incompetent at times when I can’t hit the arrow keys or escape smoothly. One solution is to use an external keyboard, but then I won’t adapt to the new feel and I’ll be stuck like this forever, unable to type competently in a meeting or any other time I’m away from my desk.
I could probably get used to the feel of the latest butterfly keys, but the arrow keys and virtual escape key and to a lesser extent virtual F-keys are intolerable. It’s like has Jony Ive ever had to type something? Hell no, he has people to do that for him, the important thing is everything he touches look immaculate in a 90-degree closeup and framed above his mantel.
The reason I'm not impressed with the new Macbook Pro is I, like a huge percentage of developers I know, use the computer as a 3rd monitor and use a different keyboard than the built in one. I'm not going to reach 3 ft away to hit a Spotify shortcut on the TouchBar ever when I can use my finger on my magic trackpad to do it in a fraction of the time. WTF. And will the function keys on my keyboard of choice even work now?
I so much wish Apple would have integrated E-Ink in their keyboard keys. I was kinda hoping from the leaks it to be true but sad :( Instead of removing function bar and putting in a stupid LCD this would have made more sense. If they were dying to put in an Apple watch display in keyboard they could have done it on trackpad!
Disclaimer: Despite all this Macbook remains my fav laptop, no other laptop including surface compares to integrated experience.
I love the short throw keys. Obviously everyone has their own personal preferences. I feel like my fingers are dancing across the new keyboard. Initially I disliked the size of the keys, but now when I go back to an older keyboard I realize I even prefer those. (Edit: I still dislike the arrow keys, those suck).
Apple’s big problem is that they cater to everyone with a single offering. And since the keyboards are cut into the metal casing of the laptop, it would probably be expensive to offer an option here (though they probably should). So they make a decision, piss off some, make others happy. This is where PCs have an advantage, as you have more choice.
Wow, I'm the complete opposite. So much so, that I bought an external keyboard with the 3 keys and eraser-knob for my desktop system. Damnit Apple, I'm USING those function keys, Fn-F7 for mute is no good; give me a single button for mute so I can make it shut-up! PLEASE give me a page-up and page-down, for when I need to go up a page and down a page, I also want a home and an end key. (Don't want a numeric keypad though.)
I do, however, very much want the same input - and the closest I've found is a Thinkpad w/ an eraser-knob and an external Thinkpad keyboard w/ the eraser-knob.
I wonder how hard it would be to build an external keyboard with 'a big touch area' out of mac parts - they're both usb to begin with, all you'd need is a sleek enclosure for it.
Macbook is a very poor choice for developer because of the keyboard without Escape key. I tried to use keyboard without Esc and it's simply too painful to use.
I don't care about the tax. But I can't buy a tool built for aliens by aliens. I could adapt to all the crazy keyboard changes all manufacturers tried over the years. But removing Esc key makes it completely unusable.
The lack of emphasis of good input is absolutely maddening when people were buying macbooks with lousy specs for the price, low-res displays for the price, who absolutely loved the fantastic trackpad, adequete keyboard, and good build quality.
Now the devices are getting more fragile and the keyboards aren't even average they're junk. The touchbar is shit. Apple seems to be regressing to their form over function puck mouse days.
Meanwhile desktop consumers are realising how undervalued input has been for a long time and are buying $100 keyboards in great quantities.
It would be really nice if Apple went back to their roots and built INSANELY AWESOME computers. With FULL keyboards instead of gimmicky touch-bar thingies.
To each their own, but I use esc heavily in vim, and brightness & volume are one in from each edge on all mac keyboards that I'm aware of, so they are easy to hit without looking. Lack of tactile buttons is going to be a huge pain in the ass.
I am inclined to agree. I do somewhat like it on my 13” MBP but do miss physical function keys. If they just let you do fn+num for the F keys it would be a big improvement…
A scissor keyboard fixes half of their keyboard problem. Next question: will the new MBP be available without the touchbar and with a conventional row of Esc and Fn keys?
Back to reality, the problem is that more than 5% of common people use those function key buttons on a daily basis, and they need that haptic feedback. I want my computer's volume, playback and brightness controls to be easily accessible. I also want to be able to use my escape key. I don't want to have to switch to some other application in order to turn the volume down or pause my music when I'm interrupted by someone, and it's nice to be able to control the screen brightness without having to switch applications in order to do so.
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