I'm from a country that has public health and free college education (Finland).
I much prefer paying bit more in taxes than having to have a bad conscience knowing that a lot of the people living in my country would not have the same options as myself.
I'm not exceedingly wealthy but I make more than the statistical average employee.
I pay a lot of taxes. It's worth it for me to live in a country with healthy and educated people and that's just the very short list. If you don't value those things, don't live there.
I'm a software engineer working in Sweden, a country I chose because of its strong welfare society among other things. With a good salary, I'm paying more tax than the majority of Swedes, my marginal tax rate is over 50%, and in the election last weekend I voted to increase one of the taxes in favour of healthcare spending. My point is that paying a lot in tax doesn't necessarily make you less happy, let alone depressed. The way I view it, I'm contributing to a system that ensures affordable education/healthcare for everyone, and extra social assistance for those in need, things I believe really help the society as a whole.
I probably pay more tax than you do (based on your comment).
I live in Sweden, in Europe. For that I (and everyone around me) have free school up to and including university studies (actually I would get paid USD 330 in grants, up to 240 weeks, plus the ability to take a loan, neither which I have to use for tuition fees).
I have nearly free health care and medicine (max costs for 12 months $120 and $230 respectively). Subsidised child care, and more.
Cost of living is lower in Sweden [1] rather than in the US, as a comparison (partially because the Swedish currency has dropped in value). But I don’t have to go bankrupt just because I got cancer and didn’t have a good health insurance or sign up for a massive debt to get a university education.
At least for those taxes, one gets somewhat free healthcare. I’d rather pay higher taxes and get access to a solid public healthcare system, rather than relying on the expensive private care in the states.
You're missing out on the significant unemployment in countries like Sweden. There is significantly better free healthcare in Australia - which has an average tax rate of 23.6%.
The correlation of high taxes = better quality of life doesn't hold much strength when you consider that there are plenty of countries doing well without it, and plenty of countries with high taxes that have a poor quality of life.
Some of my colleagues at Microsoft have worked in Denmark and they all complain about the taxation there and consider it unacceptable. I honestly can't understand that. I'd rather give half my salary in taxes to the government and get free education, healthcare and whatnot. My wife and I definitely don't aspire to be rich, as long as we're comfortable we're ok, so maybe that's our difference.
What I don't get is how people in the US pay 25% income tax and don't get outraged for getting almost nothing back. Heck, we just put our daughter in public school, and even though it's a public school we have to pay $360 a month for full Kindergarten, otherwise she can only attend 2 hours a day. Besides that, the school has to promote fundraisers to cover their costs, because apparently the only thing the state pays for is teachers' salaries. At least 911 is free.
To me it feels like all taxes I pay in the US are mostly just for funding wars :( Even in a shitty country like Brazil you get free education (up to grad school - and state universities are the best in the country), free healthcare and a state pension when you retire. Sure, it all sucks one way or another [1], not because there's not enough money but because politicians down there are extremely corrupt - fix the corruption and you get a tremendous quality of life with a 27,5% income tax.
[1] Public healthcare varies from place to place - where I lived (Porto Alegre, RS) it was ok, but in poorer places they don't have a lot of necessary equipment and are understaffed. Although state universities have a lot of research funding and the best professors, the facilities are quite poor. And the state pension is very low, but that could be fixed by fixing the high level of corruption we have first.
French here, the tuitions are close to 0 in Finland and France too (granted that you learn French). Our parents pay up to 50% (I don't have the exact percentage) of various taxes based on their salaries and daily life goods, and we as children will do the same. It makes sense that our government rewards us in some way: health care for free, school for free, retirement... In Europe, the government avoids you to shoot yourself by managing part of your money for the well being of the society. In return, we may look less rich by looking at our bank balance. If you take a 3500 $ Swedish salary with all the taxes applied, your life level might be equivalent as a 7000 $ salary in US.
Beware not to overuse this trick. In the past many other European countries were accessible for virtually free. Until an army of Chineses came, studied for free for 5 years and went back to their hometown without any contribution to the society (taxes, intellectual contributions...). That's why Sweden granted recently the free access to only Europe citizens that anyway pay common taxes in their own country.
"No healthcare costs. Scraped elbow? Free. Brain surgery? Free.
- No saving up for college for my kids.
- No student loans tuition is free in all universities and colleges.
- Goverment-paid pension savings"
It's a little disingenuous to talk about all those 'free things' that 'others' or 'the government' are paying for, because it communicates that those costs are magically externalized.
They are not, of course.
Citizens are paying for all of those things through very aggressive taxation.
Denmark has basically the highest degree of government participation in the economy in the world. [1]
Taxation in Scandinavian countries run deep.
Swedens top tax rate is 67% (!!!) though this includes social security. Payroll tax (employer side of social security) is about 30%, deducted before transfer to employee. And then after you take your money home, you pay an additional 25% VAT on everything you buy.
Think about that: Swedish company allocates $100K to employee. ~30% deducted for SS, so employees income is really $70K. Now, you pay up to 66% of that in taxes (not at 70K, but for higher income earners - certainly a lot of Google folks would!), so say 50% taxes, 'take home' is now $35K. Now, you pay 25% taxes on everything you buy. Assume people save 10% conservatively, meaning $31.5K in spending, which is about $6 VAT taxes.
So from $100K in comp, you're paying $70K to the government.
In the US obviously it would be considerably less.
I know all this has been argued before, but it's important to consider how aggressive that taxation is, I don't think it's ever fair to talk about 'no student debt' or 'free healthcare' without taking into consideration that level of taxation.
The real issue is the cost vs. quality of things like healthcare.
Now - in Canada, we have similar levels of taxation as California or New York and we get healthcare out of that, so now that's something to talk about ...
I'm told (by tax specialists) that nowadays the situation is that you pay the taxes in whichever country has the higher taxation rate, but nothing in the other country. That will be fine - I'm ok with paying higher taxes when I'm getting better services, like a good public health system that works for everyone.
What's the alternative? Restricting basic needs like education and healthcare to well earning citizens?
As a german, of course I don't enjoy paying high taxes, but that changes quickly once you actually get sick. Your health and education should be taken care of regardless of whether you're a janitor or an engineer - or their child, which can't change that status yet.
I find it quite disturbing that high taxation is seen as a negative aspect of Europe. I lived in Italy, France and Germany, and I enjoyed public healthcare and education of very high standard at very affordable prices, and free in the limit that one cannot afford to pay for them.
As a relative of a person with a chronic disease I can tell you that on the one hand if we are not bankrupt it is because of public healthcare, and on the other I'm proud of contributing through my taxes so that anybody in need can have the same treatment irrespective of their economic situation.
From what I've read, US tax burden is pretty similar to Europe if you include health insurance costs, you just get less for it. Property prices are the main thing that seems much worse in Europe, but that doesn't have anything to do with taxes.
Donating my income is besides the point, as it's the top income brackets that really need to be taxed. I would and do happily vote for higher taxes on myself when the option is available.
I much prefer paying bit more in taxes than having to have a bad conscience knowing that a lot of the people living in my country would not have the same options as myself.
I'm not exceedingly wealthy but I make more than the statistical average employee.
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