Hacker Read top | best | new | newcomments | leaders | about | bookmarklet login

So both are diverse and have large foreign populations. But SV’s diversity largely comes from immigrants in search of the American Dream, most of whom tend to have affinity with the rest of America as well.

Manhattan in contrast has a lot of global citizens who would have more affinity with other cosmopolitan cities like London and Paris than with the rest of America.



sort by: page size:

The US is a big place. Which city are you actually interested in? SV is suburbia. Housing tracts, car centric. NYC is a large city with reasonable public transportation, not London but as close as you can get in the USA.

I have lived both places (SF in the dotcom period) and now live in New York.

I love SV for many things and there are many great people there, but at the end of the day, New York is my city because its more human, honest, candid and less tribal.


It's easy for talented people in the US to move to SV and NYC. It's a lot harder for the same kind of people abroad to move to SV and NYC.

I think some of us may really like to hear specifics regarding these stunning differences. I grew up in NY and as far as I can tell both NY and SV are high tax areas with extremely high costs of living.

I don't get that comment. My experience is the complete opposite.

People in SV like to think they have unconventional ideas, but they all think the same way. ie, if you don't have the same pseudo-thought-provoking-disruptive ideas as the others, you will be laughed at literally.

I will quote Noam Chomsky, that perfectly summarizes SV in my opinion: ` One of the ways you control what people think is by creating the illusion that there’s a debate going on, but making sure that that debate stays within very narrow margins. `

NYC is way more diverse both graphically and in thoughts as you have people having completely different lifes, in different type of industries, with real-issues at hands.


The point about NYC is spot-on (it's also one of the reasons I've been thinking about making the move to SV myself).

Bottom line: In SV people who make stuff are respected. In NYC people who make money are respected.

Obviously this is not true 100% across the board, but anyone who has experienced both cities will immediately grok what I'm talking about.


There's 8.6 million people in the NYC legal limits, over 20 million in it's greater metro, and a way more diverse economy. You'd need waaaaay more tech to get anywhere close to SV, which just isn't that big population wise.

Is there a difference? A lot of people would only want to visit in NY or SF but plenty others would happily live their whole lives there. The existence of a vibrant culture should tell you that some people do like living there (otherwise the culture wouldn't exist).

The NYC question did sound weird and somewhat like ad-hominem attack. You probably wanted to ask why OP found NYC better than SV?

P.S. I didn't downvote vote


when did SV become a "city" comparable, in any way besides housing prices, to nyc?

Thankfully NY is also not as PC and SJW filled as SV, which helps cement NY as a friendlier, equal place to live. Meritocracies in spirit as well as letter!

Compared to this, it's fun to live and work in NYC. Here everybody assumes that everybody else can be an immigrant, or at least moved across the country to live here. But everybody also assumes that everybody else may be local, independently from the skin color, eye shape, accent, etc.

(I personally love this arrangement. I've seen it in several other cities, like London and Moscow.)


This is a huge generalization and a guess on what it means. If you are in tech, looking to live in the US from abroad, some really only consider moving to NYC or maybe SF, LA or DC. Then once in the US, you don't really ever get a feel for living anywhere else in America. Whereas US born citizens living in NY or SF probably grew up somewhere else, so they have more of a connection with the rest of America.

And NYC offers far more in terms of services. Obviously the politics and needs of the states and NYC in particular are quite different.

The other advantage the valley has is newly rich people are willing to live there based on its climate. New York survives in large part because of the ecosystem of arts and entertainment focused on rich people who live there. Random City USA is unlikely to have both, but they can be better.

I've been in both places recently and currently live in NYC. We may have to agree to disagree because to me, the difference is pretty stark.

Lots of good pros/cons of New York mentioned in these comments, so just one thing to add I haven't seen mentioned: after 7 years living & working in Manhattan/Brooklyn, my network is saturated with people in a dozen different industries who all seem to have careers advancing at 2x speed of the people I know anywhere else.

I consistently meet people in their late 20's and early 30's who are serious players in a wide variety of business and artistic endeavors. I don't have to go more than one degree of separation to find someone at the top of any field. I know less entrepreneurs here than in SV, but the cross-pollination in NYC is a big deal.


To address one small part of this:

I've always found most of America outside New York to be hostile toward foreigners. This is one reason I love New York so much: nobody is from here, and even those who are, still have an identity and heritage that points to somewhere else (which they are usually proud of).

That diversity in background produces an attitude that I believe is unmatched anywhere else, and contrasts sharply with the bay area. And despite our city's reputation for being expensive, people from every economic band live here successfully while working hard to pull themselves into the next bracket.

To the OP: It sounds like you need a vacation more than anything. But after you take that, why not try out the city where everyone is going through the same immigration woes as you?

next

Legal | privacy