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Safer, maybe, but nothing beats truly owning real estate.

I have a few rental properties, all managed by a property management co.

I can cash out re-fi and roll it into another property tax free, rinse and repeat. Buy > Rehab > Rent > Refinance > Repeat.

I can take the property and sell if it appreciates.

I can do a 1031 tax exchange for a similar property.

Or I can just continue to rent it out.

Best part is I can use other people's money as leverage to buy much more property, and if the deal makes sense at the time of purchase/deal analysis, I won't be over-leveraged and will stand to make money, with multiple exits as options.

After paying off the note, I can seller finance it to someone (rent-to-own) if I wish, at whatever interest rate I/my buyer deems appropriate.

Can't do that with REITs, unfortunately. But in terms of being truly passive, REITs fit the bill!



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How is this better than just renting and also putting some money into a reit each month?

Edit: I suppose one reason would be if you want to rent, but you like a house that's not on the rental market. Any others?


No it's not. In many cases it can be beneficial to rent and invest your money instead, as stocks have a higher longterm ROI than property.

Largely offtopic but:

You are not incorrect per sé. REITs exists in an awful large number of varieties in every possible flavor and indeed broadly reflect what you describe, i.e. an exposure to a Real Estate. You get paid a dividend (which would be similar to the cashflow you receive from a rental property you own). There are a number of upsides of investing in REITs over buying a property and renting it out: - less work (no need to manage tenants) - less risk (it's a diverse set of properties across multiple locations vs a single property in one location). - highly liquid (you can buy any amount and sell virtually whenever you want you need to liquidity)

there is some downside: - it is not tangible as a property (sometimes that means that if you don't understand exactly what you bought under what conditions it can mean you have some unknown exposure/risk you were not aware of). - it has less upside generally (in terms of risk/reward, it is a much safer investment but with that there is also upside as if you were to own a single property in the right neighborhood). - less leverage (generally you get more leverage on your mortgage than on your investment account)

Particularly the last points is what catches people often. I.e. if you are renting a property and everyone else is owning, and the properties go up, you will feel 'stupid'. People love bragging how they got rich by buying and 'flipping' and ofcourse this happens and has happened in the past. But for all those great stories you don't hear the people that bought and were stuck with the house, had to sell at 'firesale price' because they lost a job/got divorced/etc etc. In the end, buying and owning property with leverage is a choice that fits a certain lifestyle and SHOULD not be for everyone. There are a lot of other investment opportunities in the set for any individual that would be better suited but are often considered 'complex'. Owning a house is simple and has been pushed for decades to 'build' wealth.

The reality is that for most people their housing cost is by far the largest fraction of their cost of living. Owning alleviates this costs to a certain extend if only psychologically, but it does not come risk free (the number of times I heard people say 'house prices only go up'). The leverage factor aside (which is a real thing), looking from a person investing their savings, an appropriate allocation would be something dependent on their age but in any case not much over 10% in Real Estate. About as much on commodities (GOLD/precious metals/etc), Fixed Income depending on age but somewhere between 20% percent earlier in career with little commitments and up to 70% in retirement, with the rest in stocks ideally globally diversified. That all being loosely based on the highest risk-adjusted return models (or how any active manager would run your fund from a top level).

Obviously, this is boring and it is way more smarter to buy this sexy property and flip it a couple times and those tenants are not an issue cause 'you love dealing with them anyways and have nothing better to do'. Basically risk-free money and you didn't even work for it. /s


Suppose a large, publicly listed real estate investment trust (REIT) owned a diversified portfolio of housing across the country and operated it all as rental housing. Tenants could buy shares in the REIT and thereby invest not only in their own house, but all the others as well. Less risk and more flexible than home ownership.

The downside for tenants is not being able to renovate. The upside is not being responsible for maintenance.


You do both to diversify (equity and real estate). Having the property as a rental is very tax efficient as well (you get to depreciate a property that appreciates in value). Also, no one is going to let you leverage equity purchases with debt like you can with real estate.

Disclosure: I own several rental properties to round out my investment portfolio.


That's just the risk of investing in real estate directly instead of through a financial instrument.

I can manage my real estate risk better (IMHO) in a rising interest rate environment better than a REIT can (and I find most REITs to be overvalued, specifically O). My cash on cash returns are better as well.

I can invest in a lot more rental markets and manage idiosyncratic risk. Plus I don't have to deal with maintenance issues with physical property upkeep.

I have also invested in vehicles (private offerings) that fund residential construction especially in housing constrained markets. Very nice reliable returns


I'm not sure that it's Airbnb. if properties can appreciated at 10% per year. Then they are a much better investment and safer investment vehicle than most of what is out there. If I truly believe I can buy a house somewhere and get 10% year in and year out. I'm going to buy one. I might keep it vacant since I don't feel like being a landlord or dealing with rent control laws. When it's time to get my money out, I'll sell and move on.

While some of us might not believe this, there are enough people who see real estate as such a safe investment. Some of them are from other countries and they're looking for a place to park their money that's not a bank or volatile like the stock market.


Yes and yes. Owning a single property is less diversified, with more risk and more potential returns.

Honestly, I'd leverage it to purchase real estate split between some rentals and rehabs when the right opportunity came up. For me the passive income of rentals and being able to leverage the $500k into far more is just to attractive. If you just put $500k into the market or business ideas, your level of risk varies more and the payoff is far into the future if ever. People are scared of real estate still some because of the last bust, but the reality is it is the single greatest generator of sustained wealth. Even people that make their money in other places like a startup, eventually find out that leveraging liquidity to enter the real estate market pays back in huge ways.

Real estate isn't risk free, but even in down cycles you don't lose all your value, e.g. a $200k house doesn't become worth $0. The key wealth generator (not get rich quick scheme) in the history of the US and most Countries is real estate (land/property etc). This means finding and buying in the right areas and not being afraid to cross state lines etc. Leveraging the $500k in California won't get you really far, but doing it most other places will let you really do quite well and you can have passive income coming in within a few months.

Also, done right, you'll still have a significant amount of the money to invest into other things like the stock market to diversify yourself.


Well one big one is that you don't have to risk several orders of magnitude more money every time you move by buying property..?

Is a REIT usually better for a more passive investment? Or does investing directly in a property gives greater control of returns?

What’s risky about the investment? I’m of the impression that real estate is one of the more stable investments, subprime mortgage scandals notwithstanding.

The best investments are those that are used to produce income. Passively investing in real estate means buying an asset that produces no income, costs taxes/maintenance/insurance, and the structure declines in value due to people wanting new things, not old things.

The net result is you're relying on increasing demand to make money, which only works for location, location, location.


What do you suggest is better than rental real-estate as a income-producing asset to invest in? Entrepreneurship is great and all but the risk is frighteningly high

No. You want to keep your investment portfolio diversified. Putting even 20% of it in a single piece of real estate is a huge risk.

There are very specific reasons a house is a better investment than an REIT.

1. Taxes - There are tax breaks to owning 2. Property Management - For an REIT you pay a property manager. If you own, no need to manage your property. Free +1.2% return on asset! 3. Loans are heavily subsidized by the government, REITs cannot get 30 year loans at 3-4% interest. 4. Occupancy - You live here. Occupancy rate 100% so take an +.6% to returns!

If the government stopped 1 and 3, technology completely automated 2, and leases were 4 years long. Then no one would recommend buying your own house as an investment.


Indeed it does.

However as you move away from owning being an investment, the same homeowner based wealth will deteriorate and you'd likely own where it's convenient rather than trying to make money.

I don't think that's a terrible situation if your goal is to take the teeth out of the property market, rather than trying to destroy wealth in general.

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