> but this time it's just because they went to a non-Apple store/non-Apple certified store. If the battery is defective, that becomes Apple's problem when it swells, starts smoking, or has 50% capacity within a year.
The user chose to go to a non-Apple certified store. After that, there is no warranty and Apple is no longer responsible.
>Apple will not provide user replaceable batteries. It’s probably too expensive and complicated for them to do that and have waterproof devices.
I just want Apple to sell ME the battery. I dont want my battery to by crypto signed to my device.
>They instead offer replacements
Exactly, _replacement_. They wont just sell me a battery. You have to give them serial number, which in most cases means client PI. You also have to send old battery back for ~$40 credit to make the whole thing any financial sense.
>and third-party shops know how to replace batteries too
Apple store replaces battery in 2 hours, third party needs to explain to every single client why he needs to wait couple of days because you cant actually keep a stock of genuine batteries. Apple also wants to have access to third party service center books for 3 (or was that 5) years for "auditing :)))
> It is the same as all batteries - they degrade. Apple can’t change that.
But I have not had a battery completely stop working in the winter, ever. My car battery continues to work just fine. My camera works just fine, so does my laptop, so does my smartwatch, so does my TV remote, so does my powerdrill, so does my radio, so does my torch, so does the wall clock. But who knows, maybe I've just been lucky all these years. And BTW I'm not talking about some crazy Siberia winter. I'm talking about 30-40F here!
>But it seems the intent was to allow people to continue using their devices without upgrading and without having to pay for a battery replacement.
Apple decided to hide information that let a user decide if it was worth it to upgrade the battery. The user had no idea that their battery had degraded.
>But people who [..] and who expect that Apple should pay to support replacing batteries for the lifetime of the device, with no out-of-pocket expense for the consumer is a ridiculous double standard that no other manufacturer has ever been held to in the history of consumer electronics.
Then you should have bought a PC with a battery you can take out, instead of Apple's garbage.
Apple makes their stuff specifically non-disassemblable by third parties. If you buy Apple hardware, you get a repair if Apple wants to give you one, and you pay the price Apple wants you to pay.
I'm proud to say I've never bought a piece of Apple hardware in my life. This is one of the many reasons behind that decision.
> And yes, at the point where the throttling was taking place, the battery wasn’t defective.
Sure, but if I decide I really need a top-shape battery, and I go into an Apple Store and offer to pay full retail price for a new one, shouldn't they give it to me? GP says they were refusing if the battery was above a certain threshold (but low enough that performance adjustments were kicking in.)
> Thus, Apple acted in good faith to maximize the battery life on these older devices. The reason is technical, so it's hard to communicate this in a way that all consumers can understand. Yes, they failed at this. Look at all the confusion.
Nothing in your longwinded explanation of battery basics says anything about why I can't go into an Apple store and pay full price for a replacement.
> "your options were to either deal with the crap performance, or void your warranty by installing a third party battery."
Or pay Apple a not-entirely-unreasonable fee to get them to replace the battery ($49 IIRC?), a bit more than the third party price but perhaps worth it for peace of mind.
> If there's any supporting evidence, or anything that's come up in discovery that Apple acted in bad faith
I know it's not apple's way of doing things, but can you think of a legit good reason why they couldn't service your phone with a new battery for a price instead?
>When Apple cannot control which batteries get swapped into their devices, their brand is at risk due to fires caused by bad batteries.
I never seems this argument when you install after market car parts and install the parts yourself or your neighbor or some random car service, if you changed your lightbolb in the car and the engine breaks 1 month later you can't void my engine warranty. When I install a cheap battery, the pone burns and I bring it to warranty then the warranty people can photo the phone, show the problem, show the faulty battery and I am at fault.
If you are concern that evil people are out to get Apple, those evil people have many other ways to do it, there is no good reason to screw 99,99% of your user because some random guy install a cheap battery and then puts a photo and rand on the internet, that does nothing, there was a need for thousands of people to complain about the keyboard issues before most(but not all) of Apple fans believed that Apple could make a mistake(so a few rants won't have any effect).
> Do you have a source for that? This would change my opinion on this story.
I can vouch for this. My iPhone 6 was under 2 years old and had 82% battery health according to the Apple diagnostics when I experienced the unexpected shutdowns.
The shutdowns were frequent (at least once per day) and, because the phone had to be plugged in before it could be restarted, were incredibly frustrating.
I took it to an Apple Store. The Genius refused to acknowledge any fault. They ran the diagnostics which showed 82% and refused to replace the battery, even if I paid, as it was above their 80% threshold for replacement.
I spoke to the manager, and they stood firm. No replacement, even if I paid. I was extremely persistent and they simply would not budge.
> I've had aftermarket battery repairs swell up, which is a safety risk.
My friends at support had to deal with dozens of original Apple batteries that swelled up. And, contrary to what people may think, Apple doesn't consider a swollen battery a safety issue.[0] But, for certain models, they would replace it at no fee (although such support programs have ended IIRC).
> Why do people have to come in to the Apple Store to replace their batteries?
That’s how Apple tends to handle almost all warranty issues. Either that or you can mail it in.
iPhones are not exactly designed to be easily opened and messed with by normal people. It’s part of how they get them so thin (insert various other theories that may or may not apply here).
> So I never saw any indication that this was malicious on Apple’s part.
The problem is that if Apple admitted to the fact that old batteries were the problem they would get a class-action lawsuit to force them to allow batteries to be replaced ... like every other bloody phone.
Apple absolutely deserves this. They hid it intentionally because they knew what the followup was going to be and they didn't want to do it.
> If you want easily swappable batteries, get a different machine.
Apple doesn't make a different machine.
Obviously what you mean is to buy from a different vendor, which is what I expect to do when the time comes for a new laptop. But how is it good for Apple that they got my money last time and won't get it next time?
> As for third party repair, it isn't Apples fault if a third party repairs a phone incorrectly. What does this argument even mean?
It's 100% not their fault if someone else gets it wrong, it's true. But modern phones are complicated devices -- if you get your battery replaced poorly, and a month later your phone dies because the case was resealed incorrectly which compromised the water resistance and something got damaged as a result, is the consumer likely to think "oh, I bet that was a poor third party repair" or "ugh, iPhones suck, they're so unreliable"?
That said, I don't think this battery change is particularly tied to the personal repair issue. I think this is a shot at the resale / refurb market. Companies buying up old phones, "refreshing" them with crappy components, and selling them on to customers who don't realize that the phone is going to need a battery replacement in three months. In that case the customer didn't have the information available to tell that they'd been sold something shoddy, whereas now they can check the battery health and see this new warning.
> Something interesting is that it seems that you are paying a "deposit" on replacement batteries, which is refunded when you return your old battery.
And your problem with this is what, exactly ?
If you are genuinely repairing something then we're only talking a small window when you will be out of pocket (the time between receiving the part, replacing old one, sending old one back).
Apple do the same thing with iPhone exchanges under Apple Care. They'll send you out a brand new iPhone in advance (to allow you to transfer data etc. as required), but they'll take a deposit. If you don't send your broken iPhone back, they'll keep the deposit. Seems perfectly fair to me.
AFAIK in one way or another, the practice is widespread in the IT industry. For example, I recently replaced a Dell monitor on warranty. They didn't take payment up-front, but they certainly made it clear to me in no uncertain terms that I would be charged if I failed to return the monitor.
In terms of Apple specifically, its basically the way they work with their Authorised Service Providers. If the AASP fails to return parts, then the cost is billed to their company's account with Apple.
The reality is that in the world we live in, these sorts of parts/repair services are subject to fraud and other malicious use. So manufacturers (whether Apple or otherwise) are perfectly entitled to protect themselves.
I’m not defending the somewhat emotional / hyperbolic tone of the comment to which you replied. Just considering that they may not have adequately explained that they were referring to two separate cases (though it isn’t clear from the comment that the difference is recognized).
For my own anecdotal response, my Apple products last many years. They are consistently in good working order by the time I choose to upgrade. I also think that those who still believe that Apple has some nefarious scheme to build-in obsolescence are being manipulated by FUD, and that is based on firsthand knowledge.
The user chose to go to a non-Apple certified store. After that, there is no warranty and Apple is no longer responsible.
reply