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> the community of squirrels have no ability to retaliate

Tell that to my garden.

(I don't condone messing with wildlife in any way. However, I would like my arugula to grow up not behind bars.)



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>I dont want coyotes and bobcats around my house. neither does anyone who has pets or livestock

Only people who do a poor job of looking after their pets and livestock fear natural predators the way you do.


> something like a pellet gun to remove pests like squirrels from existence.

Despite living in the city, this probably wouldn't do much. They always come back. I have chipmunks that I have not seen in over a year and yet I hear them bark a warning call when I am apparently approaching their vicinity. I bet they have been at some of my tomatoes this year.

I have regular rabbits and this year, one or more racoons have moved into the neighborhood. I have seen skunks and wild turkey in my yard in the past. We have deer but they don't jump my fence since we installed the 6 footers.

The rabbits definitely do some damage, but one of them is my bud. He hangs out about 6 feet from me and eats clover while I weed my garden.


> Land ownership makes sense to beasts and man.

Yeah that’s why I’ve never seen a dog, cat, mole, mouse, squirrel, etc. on my personally owned property.


> I wish they would just stay away from me and I’d happily respond in kind :’( I mean, that’s kinda the line I draw and live with.

Anything in the house is fair game. I don’t feel good about it, but mice, insects, or anything else that’s in my living space has to go. I’ll do what I need to to keep my living space mine.

Anything outside… that’s shared space. As much as I can I try and co-exist. I see the bugs as much a part of the nature I appreciate as the bunnies, the deer, the turkeys, the foxes, the ducks, and everything else. None of it exists without the rest. Anything that isn’t an existential threat to myself or my property I leave alone. If I can’t personally handle them right now, I can always go back in the house.

Where I can, I try and balance my use of the space with everything else. I appreciate the nature where I live, so I only do what’s necessary to make it livable for me. I mow only enough space around the house for us to use. I’ve been working on evicting some groundhogs because they’re trying to turn the ground under my garage into swiss cheese. I get rid of poison ivy when it encroaches in our space but we don’t “weed”. When the mosquitos got so bad we were scared to open a door I did spray some pesticide immediately around our house, but made sure to keep the space I sprayed well mowed to discourage the bees from coming here and getting caught in the crossfire.

I guess it’s just a small mindset shift—I still want the bugs to stay away from me, but I can’t be pissed about bugs when I wander into their home any more than I could wander in to a bear’s den and be annoyed that a bear attacked me.

Oh, except ticks. Fuck ticks. Those are kill on sight.


> People are being told to pull down feeders, to ignore those birds now begging for food at the window. Good luck enforcing that rule.

"Bird-feeder? No no, that's my squirrel feeder."


> We just don't want them stalking our children in the local park.

Exactly. I'm all for conservation, so long as it doesn't lead to humans becoming part of the food chain again.


> life is suffering

Not sure why I'm sharing this, but I saw a hawk kill a squirrel yesterday. It was standing on top of the squirrel (still alive) on my neighbor's lawn.

Three other squirrels were screeching and they made futile charges at the hawk to try to free the other squirrel.

The amount of distress / suffering / chaos was far more disturbing than I would have expected to see on a suburban lawn. I even considered intervening and trying to scare the hawk away.

But the hawk's gotta eat, too.

Plus, it probably would've kicked my ass.

*edits for better phrasing.


>Does anyone know what would happen to the squirrel if he/she realizes their entire year's of investment is gone

Greys forget, reds probably don't but they are so angry fighting each other most of the time over control of territory including the caches.

>would another squirrel help it out?

They'd eat each other before starving. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/article/red-squir...


> Also, rats aren't so bad.

If you’re blessed (cursed?) with a population that consists of a large number of ground dwelling birds, rats are the enemy. I’m in New Zealand.


> I would like to see things as natural as possible. And feral pigs don’t have a place on this continent.

That's a strange -- and dangerous -- thing to say for an American of European origin.


>Eastern grey squirrels were deliberately introduced into city parks for the enjoyment of people.[1]

Did not know — thanks for this.

Also, this has to be the dumbest move in the history of urban planning (considering squirrels track record as an invasive species). It'd appear someone didn't think this through 100%.

Where is the zoologist on the city board when you need one, right?


> You could never domesticate a robin.

I dunno. We domesticated the Rock Dove just fine.


The previous sentence was:

>Better yet, live in the forest and eat whatever the squirrels don't want.

I think he was building on his joke.


> I wish we were China, they will kill all the deer

I think that Chinese learned that lesson yet.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Pests_campaign

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Removing all the deer suddenly would raise a nuclear explosion of rodents. Ecology is complicated (but fair).


> They’re certainly noisy, and they defecate on people and property with abandon (and in great volume—a pigeon produces a hefty 25 pounds of excrement per year), but you can say the same about lots of animals.

No you really can't, I have never been shat on by any wild animal besides a pigeon. What animal besides a pigeon shits on a statue so much it visibly coats it in a layer, squirrels certainly don't.

Seriously it's the shit.


>are very reluctant to cause them direct harm

After we’ve hunted them into endangered status.


>> Usually this is said by someone who politically doesn't care about wildlife

Whether someone cares about wildlife does not affect whether a logical argument is true or not.


> chickens are omnivores and opportunistic predators

Boy are they. Once I got a squirrel to let go of a baby cardinal, only for it to drop to the ground where my chickens fell upon it like velociraptors.


> I had expected when I started putting out food for these, especially the crows (which are known to be able to easily learn to recognize individual humans and learn which humans are threats and which are not) to quickly learn that I'm not a threat.

Birds are second-level smart. They've seen hundreds, thousands of humans. Most of them are a noops. The next largest fraction of them are pains in the ass. The next largest fraction feeds birds, but still hates crows. Then there's some fraction that feed animals just to trap/shoot/kill them, like rats, squirrels, rabbits, doves, even deer. Ain't hardly nobody in hell that feeds birds because they just like doing that.

Birds are smart and they see everything. They aren't gonna chance it. Forget about being friends.

But kudos on your careful eye.

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