You seem unaware of the many and myriad reasons organ transplants are performed. Like you get that by the time doctors are considering it, it's because the alternative is they think you're either (1) going to die soon when it becomes necessary or (2) is necessary right now.
Did you know there are people who survive COVID and wind up in kidney failure from the stress on their body? What's your answer to them? Oh right: hope you can get a kidney and then enjoy life on immunosuppressant drugs.
But you know, go tell those dialysis patients on the waiting list that actually they're not that important.
If you are rich enough to think buying kidneys makes sense, I implore you to advocate for better health care which improves the odds of keeping your own original equipment from the manufacturer functioning adequately.
Transplant is not all upside. You remain on drugs for life. You may die anyway if your body rejects the transplant.
I see a lot of pro-transplant headlines on HN. People don't seem to want to hear any criticism of organ transplants.
But I think organ transplants are "ooh, shiny tech" that makes for good headlines not actually good medicine. I think good medicine would fix you, not turn you into Frankenstein so doctors can feel powerful.
Keeping people healthy is boring, doesn't really get tracked, no one cares. Letting their lives go to hell and then "saving" them makes for good headlines.
I have a condition that accounts for a lot of organ transplants. I would rather keep my own organs functioning.
All of HN loathes me for having that opinion. But if you think you are at risk of "needing" a transplant and have resources, I encourage you to actively look for other solutions to advocate for.
We mostly don't hear the horror stories about transplant. If that got more publicity, maybe people wouldn't be so quick to act like I'm some kind of nutter for having opinions about the topic.
One never knows that they might eventually need an organ transplant. Two years ago I was feeling reasonably healthy for my age but internally a uncommon auto immune disease are fighting a battle and my kidney were losing it with hardly any symptoms of the damage. In a manner of months I had some joint pains that wouldn't go away and my weight started ballooning. I went to the doctor and he didn't take it seriously until tests indicated that I was stage 4 kidney disease. Generally at this point is it too late and kidney function may slowly degrade further over time.
I found my diagnosis at that point and even if discovered early the auto immune disease I have still doesn't have a cure to stop it other than treat the symptoms. My short term hopes are to stay healthy as possible and when required switch to dialysis and try to live a long normal life until I get a transplant. But in most places in the US, a kidney transplant takes 3-5 years on a list due to organ shortage. In many parts of the EU the wait is just under a year. Also organ transplant is not a cure in any way since one needs a lifetime of drugs to keeps prevent rejection but it is better than dialysis in trying to live a normal life.
On the question of organ donation being opt-in/out I certainly would like a shorter wait time but I would like people to be informed as much as possible to make a decision. I think much of it is people believing it will never happen to them that they need it. But just remember that on a roll of dice things can change for you without even knowing it.
“Post any transplant, kidney, heart whatever, your immune system is shut off,” Caplan said. “The flu could kill you, a cold could kill you, COVID could kill you. The organs are scarce, we are not going to distribute them to someone who has a poor chance of living when others who are vaccinated have a better chance post-surgery of surviving.”
I think that organ sales are substantially more complicated than this conversation is making it, but your point here could not possibly make less sense. It should be obvious with a moment's thought that "My family and I will starve right now" is way worse than "there's a small chance my second kidney will fail and then my family will starve" (and that's without considering the effect on the person who got a transplant).
Reminds me of chemotherapy and countless other medical procedures. We do the best with what we've got. It's not like we're going to collectively say, "not going to do anything until we've come up with the perfect solution to this ailment." To an extent, I try to keep this in mind when arguing with the engineering devil on my shoulder that constantly shouts, "no, you have to do it right!"
I imagine your prognosis without a transplanted kidney is markedly worse.
This is a pretty odd remark. The effect of living with one kidney isn't some sort of unknown thing we need to reason about from first principles, we know pretty well what life is like for kidney donors. And I don't know about 'really have to', but it doesn't seem like 'saving someone's life' is a trivial or stupid reason.
I am a kidney transplant recipient. I received my transplant 9 years ago.
My immunosuppressive treatments is a walk in the park compared to the 6 months I was on dialysis. I got married and had a kid after my transplant, none of which I even considered while I was on dialysis.
Which is to say, you are horribly misinformed. :). I hope you will read more about organ donation before making the decision to not opt in.
A friend of mine had a kidney transplant this past summer. She was required to be vaccinated against covid (already had it). She also had to lose a significant amount of weight and pass several tests for blood pressure and other medical risks. They told her that they needed to ensure that whoever received a donor kidney would survive long enough to make it worth “spending” the kidney on, since they are in such short supply. That makes sense to me.
If she had been a smoker who refused to stop, could not lose the weight, or not taken measures like getting the vaccine, she would have been considered unqualified.
If you're not likely to survive very long with an organ transplant, you're not going to get one. Organs don't grow on trees.
Underlying medical conditions, refusal to follow medical orders, an unhealthy lifestyle (smoking, alcoholism, drug abuse) are all reasons to pass you over for someone more likely to survive with a transplant.
Medical resources aren't infinite, even when money isn't an issue.
Maybe you should consider actually thinking about the issue before deciding? Why don't you read the article and get back to me. Literally everyone is better off if we have a liquid market in kidneys.
> If you are rich enough to think buying kidneys makes sense,
Again: when serious people (i.e. not a bunch of stoned Silicon Valley überlibertarians at Burning Man) discuss this topic it’s generally assumed that the government is the sole buyer of live organ donations. The United States is certainly rich enough to make it work—indeed, it already covers a huge percentage of dialysis in the country via the Medicare ESRD program.
Anyway, I’m not a doctor but I don’t think it’s especially controversial that some people today will die without a kidney transplant, and it’s a bit too late for preventative efforts for them. Personally I would rather they have the option to get a new kidney rather than tell them “sorry, we don’t want to play God and turn you into a Frankenstein.” But maybe I’m too rich to understand.
You seem unaware of the many and myriad reasons organ transplants are performed.
I'm not. I'm just skeptical that putting more time, energy and money into headline grabbing "heroics" actually makes people healthier and I am very concerned that it only turns people like me into guinea pigs for people who want some limelight more than they want (people like) me to experience some kind of reasonable quality of life.
> So it's not like you sacrifice yourself to save 3000 people, it's sacrificing yourself for a chance to have two kidney patients where you only had one.
This is somewhat dismissive and feels unfair.
There is a huge QoL difference between an existence on Dialysis (CAPD being less miserable than haemo - but still hard) and post transplant life.
However, I agree with your end position. I don't think I would accept a live donor kidney from a loved one, so accepting from a stranger would feel unreasonable.
I keep hoping for the mythical "grown" organ to resolve issues - but I have concluded it will not be in my lifetime
I just want something like this for my next kidney transplant, I'm so sick of the meds, yes I'm blessed to be alive and living a really good life, but man the 2nd kidney is starting to give me anxiety. Context: Transplant isn't a cure to my autoimmune disease, it will slowly pick away at the graft and have me needing another. Love reading about this kind of stuff.
> the soul isn't just the heart or brain, it's every organ.
I'm sorry but this isn't some Facebook group, so, [citation very much needed]. No one is saying this procedure is without disadvantages, but for most people it outweighs ending their lives prematurely. Also it's very rare that people with only 1 faulty kidney get a transplant. Usually they get it because both kidneys are failing.
Did you know there are people who survive COVID and wind up in kidney failure from the stress on their body? What's your answer to them? Oh right: hope you can get a kidney and then enjoy life on immunosuppressant drugs.
But you know, go tell those dialysis patients on the waiting list that actually they're not that important.
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