> Only problem is with 2 feet of snow on the ground, no one will bike or walk
In the absence of systems for snow removal, most people wouldn't be driving in 2 feet of snow either (yes, some do it, but some people drive in all sorts of reckless circumstances).
The cities in the intersection of "viable to thrive without a car" and "get a lot of snow" mostly do a good job of dealing with the latter to preserve the former. They usually clear snow quickly on the thoroughfares, sidewalks and bike lanes and have other solutions (tunnels, non-road transit, etc) for managing the more difficult journeys.
> ie, there is ONLY the road to walk on, and it's unsafe because of the snow
As a Finn, the first part is an infrastructure issue and you're building it wrong, and the second part is just plain old weird; snow on the ground doesn't make walking unsafe. Too much snow makes walking slower and more tiring, but that circles back to infrastructure, specifically snow plowing.
> Places that regularly get snow don't really ever take 3 days to clear it, there is capacity to clear it continuously.
With all due respect that's a load of hooey. Northern towns generally have capacity to clear a normal winter's snow. On the other hand, we have gotten well above a normal winter.
First, the snow event can last a couple of days. Even after the large amount of snow gets done, winds can exceed 30 mph with gusts above 50mph. This makes any sort of travel a non-starter. Worse are the storms that start with a sleet / light rain (early and late winter) and then freeze before the actual snows show up.
After the event, you are faced with moving the snow. Late winter storms are fairly brutal if the ditches are already filled with snow. This assumes you can get people to all the emergency equipment in a timely manner. This also assumes the budget is holding for all the overtime.
You can easily be stuck in your residence for 3 days and sometimes a week. Hope the power company is on the ball because that's a load of fun in itself. The 96 storm in ND had people stuck for a week if you were anywhere off the main route. Never mind the damage to the power grid and the setup for the 97 flood.
>When there's snow on the road hiding lane markings, someone will come and clean it out.
In New England, snow can completely cover the road surface for days or even weeks at a time, and ever-changing piles of snow cover the curbs and parts of the lanes. Humans just choose a path without regard to where the lanes are in the summer. On some roads this turns a four lane road into a two lane road with a lane-width snow pile between the lanes. In a few spots it turns a two lane road into a one lane, with drivers from different directions taking turns.
>Imagine if 10in were forecast and then NYC actually got 2 feet.
i'm imagining it, and not really seeing the problem. 10" and 2' are both enough snow that you probably don't want to drive in it unless you have to. It might make a difference for the snow plow operators or the skiers, but for the average person the only thing they need to know is "should i plan to drive to work in the morning" and the weather forecasters correctly predicted "no".
>All you needed was to shovel like 20 meters of path and maybe a wheelbarrow.
According to the article some of the areas are getting 30 inches of snow and ice!
With drifts easily doubling that, I could see how 20 meters could quickly become near impossible to clear by hand, especially while it's still coming down.
That's the catch. In some cities, you have to shovel snow in front of your house by a certain time or get a ticket. If you have responsibilities (kids or whatever), have to get to work, and have to shovel before heading out or take a fine, you don't exactly have time to do it slowly. Health be damned.
> the northeast and midwest get really bad snowstorms
I’m curious what the supposed issues around snowstorms are. In the Midwest at least you typically lose a day of “work” (not going into the office) a couple times per winter and that’s only because of school closures. The roads are rarely an issue for more than a couple hours unless it’s REALLY bad storm.
I don’t see why you couldn’t keep running the fabs through that.
Yeah, probably true. But the concern often isn't the snow itself, it's when it later freezes. Then it's too late to plow it, and the rugged and uneven slippery surface is impossible to bike on.
Snow is a major quality of life and safety issue. People from snowy climates will tell you it's not a big deal, but I'm from somewhere without snow, now living in the NE, it is definitely an issue and a major reason I won't settle here. Prepare to spend a few months every year basically stuck inside doing nothing. But that's a minor inconvenience compared to the issues with driving and even cycling. It's flat out dangerous to drive in snow, and more dangerous to drive on the black ice that remains.
There are cheap cities in America in much warmer climes.
My Canadian home town is not even walkable in the winter. You can't plot a route from home to the mall because some parts have no sidewalks at all, and snowbanks force you into muddy snow and traffic.
I've attempted it and a concerned driver stopped to tell me how dangerous it was.
> it might be an interesting analysis to see if there would be sufficient yearly yield to offset snowmelting operations in winter
There doesn't need to be sufficient yearly yield. This isn't just trying to pay for itself by collecting electricity on clear days to melt snow. It'd still be a great solution if it uses far more electricity than it collects because it's competing with snow removal trucks. If it could be cheaper and more efficient than having trucks driving around dropping salt and plowing, it'd be amazing.
Even if it's a little more costly, the ability to keep all the roads clear, all the time, would be incredible and worth some added expense. Think about how much safer the roads would be if they could remain free of snow.
> Those who who live(d) east of the Mountains handle snow just fine.
I spent most of my life in Minnesota, and even there, people think they can handle snow (which they do better than folks here in the Puget Sound region). But every year, there are huge pileups, gruesome accidents, slowdowns, etc. They, just as people east of the Cascades, have more experience, but I would stop short of saying that they 'handle it just fine.'
smaller streets with more people living on them means less snow to move and more people to move it. Also, when you're walking everywhere, snow is FUN rather than an obstacle.
Huge 2-lane roads with 2 foot of snow on them = no school.
Narrow walking streets with 2 foot of snow on them = no problem.
It sounds crazy that relatively affluent nations/cities can't handle snow, but at least here in the DC area in the US, there are a few good reasons...
1. While we do get snow every winter, it tends to be mixed with icy rain, not the powdery stuff you get in more northern climates. What tends to happen is a bit of snow will fall overnight, then go into a melt/flash-freeze cycle as the temperature hovers around freezing.
2. Because it only snow (with any major accumulation) once or twice a season, there isn't a huge incentive to invest in more snow removal equipment. The state DOT handles major roads, but neighborhoods are largely left to clear their own snow. My last neighborhood had a contract with a construction company from out of the region for major snow - they'd drive up their trucks (with plows attached) and set up camp at the edge of the area for a few days, then go home.
3. DC is highly transient. Lots of drivers who simply don't have much experience driving in snow.
4. Public transit is terrible. So, everybody tries to go to work, and if their only car is a Corvette, so be it. And of course, they spin it into a ditch as soon as they try to get on the highway.
In the absence of systems for snow removal, most people wouldn't be driving in 2 feet of snow either (yes, some do it, but some people drive in all sorts of reckless circumstances).
The cities in the intersection of "viable to thrive without a car" and "get a lot of snow" mostly do a good job of dealing with the latter to preserve the former. They usually clear snow quickly on the thoroughfares, sidewalks and bike lanes and have other solutions (tunnels, non-road transit, etc) for managing the more difficult journeys.
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