I would say the majority of people disliked the small key travel, that’s why apple “fixed” it in the latest iteration, specifically calling it out as a benefit.
What do you like more about it compared to the newer one?
Ignoring the unreliability and lack of esc key, I liked the tiny travel on the 2016-2018 MBPs, but I didn't like how crowded the keys were. In fact that part seemed objectively bad: The surface area they added does nothing but increase the chance of mistyping, since any reasonably-sized finger hitting the edge of those keys would hit an adjacent key too.
I'm finding it really odd that people are praising the new keyboard. I must admit that I have only tested it in the Apple Store, but I find it terrible, the short travel feels really bad to me. Is this something that you just get used to?
I have a 2012 MacBook Pro at home and just recently got the newest one at work. While I don't love the Touch Bar, I don't hate it like most people. I don't use any `esc` heavy apps like vim so that's a pretty big factor. The most annoying thing is honestly the lack of volume buttons.
When I use my old MacBook Pro at home the keys feel slow and spongey. The new ones are fast and crisp. I guess I've been lucky enough to not have any of them fail on me.
I much prefer it. I don't see any reason to move my hands further than I need to to get just enough physical feedback. It feels sleeker and more modern too. Large travel just slows me down. I spilled a drink on my Apple wireless keyboard, and now I'm using a pretty standard office-type USB keyboard instead. And I can tell you I'm typing far slower.
I really disagree with you about the keyboard. I was nervous that this keyboard would be annoying but I quite like it. Maybe even more than the old keyboard. Yes, they have way less key travel, but the extra click that they added more than makes up for it. I don’t have any troubles now at all with the main keyboard.
The thing I don’t like about it is the new arrow layout. The full sized left and right keys make it really hard to find the arrows by feel. It’s been months and months and I still can’t reliably find the arrows without looking, and I had no problems with the previous MacBook keyboard.
And it is worth pointing out when Butterfly keyboard first appeared on MBP, every single HN comment were praising it as the greatest keyboard ever. ( As the two comments reply you have right now )
The old MBP had 1.5mm Key travel. They could have cut it to 1.2 or 1.3. Instead they went with 0.7 with the butterfly and later 1mm to the new scissor. Light typer generally dont "dislike" slightly more key travel. But those who cant adopt to small key travel "hate" the new keyboard.
Sorry, I don’t use of those keys. I can see how differing behavior of those keys could cramp your style, but your original argument was that Apple is to blame for that. I don’t think history is on your side there.
These are almost exactly my thoughts as well coming from a 2015 MBP. I would only add that for me, I actually like the new keyboard. The low/firm travel of the keys is actually preferable for me. I felt like the old keyboards were "mushy". That's obviously a personal preference, however.
The most modern keys are orders of magnitude better for typing. The low profile butterfly keys were just not durable.
I have large hands and often bottom out on keys/keyboards. I went though three macbooks in two years at my last job. The new macbooks, I have no problem.
Unfortunately, it looks a bit like they're going with the ultra-low key travel keyboards on these new models. Very disappointed to see this. I don't understand why Apple thinks its users want this.
I love the short throw keys. Obviously everyone has their own personal preferences. I feel like my fingers are dancing across the new keyboard. Initially I disliked the size of the keys, but now when I go back to an older keyboard I realize I even prefer those. (Edit: I still dislike the arrow keys, those suck).
Apple’s big problem is that they cater to everyone with a single offering. And since the keyboards are cut into the metal casing of the laptop, it would probably be expensive to offer an option here (though they probably should). So they make a decision, piss off some, make others happy. This is where PCs have an advantage, as you have more choice.
Lots of people actually liked the 2016 keyboards, less travel is fine for many people, including me. The real problem as the susceptibility to debris breaking keys, and not being easily fixable.
So the new MacBook keyboards seemed to have the debris issue licked, and a little more travel. That’s all I need, but if you want more travel I can see it’s not there for you yet.
Well, some of those points are down to personal preference. I for instance always hated the trackpoint thing and I am fine with the new clean and simple keyboard approach.
Don't even get me started on Apple. If removing the physical Esc key is not the biggest ever fuck you to pro users, then I don't know what is.
I would say the majority of people disliked the small key travel, that’s why apple “fixed” it in the latest iteration, specifically calling it out as a benefit.
What do you like more about it compared to the newer one?
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