This is the real reason behind the FUD in my opinion. Despite all these articles presenting TikTok content as vapid and mindless time wasting, in my experience it's been the opposite. TikTok is full of authentic policial commentary, anti-racist education, historical analysis, and anti-capitalist content. It's doing a lot to give people a voice who otherwise haven't been well-represented on other platforms. It's a big reason why Reels has been a failure imo, there's just not any important conversations happening there. Gen Z is not being given enough credit, they're not just addicted scrollers, they're using a better platform to organize and share culture more effectively.
I think there's a little too much focus on the algorithm in these comments, and not enough focus on the content itself. The quality of content on Tiktok is just worlds better than anything on Reels. Reels is full of visually interesting content like hydraulic presses, food preparation, construction timelapse, etc. And that content is engaging for a few minutes, it's unique, it's fine. But it doesn't keep you coming back.
Tiktok has a rich mix of content that's silly, educational, political, impressive, sexy, etc. The amount of things I learn on Tiktok and bookmark is incredible. And Tiktok's features like stitches, duets, and shared audios make it really easy to keep a conversation going, letting creators reference each other async. Tiktok has its own unique multimedia language, using audio and visual composition to express memes. Creators choose the tone they wish to present a meme (eg use a joke audio like 'insert cash or select payment type' but pair it with serious commentary on how mental health professionals request payment at the end of a therapy session). That's why it's endlessly interesting and engaging, and to me that's the real 'secret sauce' that the copycats never can capture.
To be fair, much of the content on TikTok is more creative, more profound, or both. I see serious media criticism, commentary on the perspective of black Americans facing the threat of police brutality, lighthearted media criticism/parody, music and music history analysis, behind-the-scenes looks at a variety of unfamiliar professions, and so much more.
And this studio seems to produce high-effort, low-impact content pointing out that Google isn’t incentivized to tell children they’ve drawn penises or that people like popping balloons.
The victimhood complex is a tired look, the studio should try putting their content on TikTok, the artistic constraints might help them be more creative and original.
TikTok is an interesting case because on the one hand they have some fantastic content, cooking videos, explainers, etc. On the other hand how that content is delivered is absolute garbage (from the POV of sucking out attention).
You're really downplaying Tiktok. When it was starting up it was mostly a collection of teens dancing and making memes. Now there's content for everything made by a huge spectrum of people. Every person that relies on social media to maintain a brand needs to be on tiktok now. You scroll long enough and it'll feed you content hyper specific to your personality. I don't want to join Tiktok specifically because I know it'll show me things I enjoy but in a condensed form that will slowly rot away my attention span.
I think that's only partially true. There's a reason TikTok (and Instagram reels) is extremely popular - it keeps feeding the user content of its choosing.
I think there's a few considerations on the potential for TikTok. IG is laden with ads to where it degrades the UX (every 2-4 pics/videos is an ad), it's been taken over by insta "models" and paid-for-content which makes it less appealing to the average joe/jane, it tries to do too much.
From my limited exposure what I'm seeing is that a ton of millennials are on TikTok making funny videos. I mean, TONS of people in past weeks. I checked it out maybe a year or so ago and it was all teenagers, but now it's millennials which btw are the users that made facebook/instagram what they became. So far it isn't laden with ads, the UX is very simple (1 video at a time and that's it), it's owned by a massive Chinese conglomerate with deep pockets and a likely appetite to take on FB.
edit: as someone else said the feature that makes it unique is the ability to use the audio from anyone else's video. They also have a large catalog of existing audio to choose from...
This is a fantastic article that makes a sterling attempt to get to the bottom of why TikTok feels different to other platforms.
If you're someone who doesn't get it yet, consider it a sign that it's worth your investment in time and energy to really try and get it, if you want to stay on top of how younger people think, work, act and play.
From the article and some comments here a few suggestions:
- TikTok is 'showing' while other platforms are 'telling'.
- You don't 'hunt' videos you 'gather' them.
- Flaws are truth, so they are typically welcomed rather than scrubbed.
I get the feeling TikTok has played themselves. Their format is super addictive, and it works, but the problem is that with something super addictive people lose interest sooner.
It's not an actual drug so you can't just keep upping the dosage. I don't have the internal metrics and I'm sure they are still making gains, but I think their wave is going to be much smaller than Facebooks.
It's still very popular of course but just judging by the number of times phones have been shoved in my face to watch a tiktok at social events recently vs a year ago I have to feel their is some level of decline. I also notice that even the younger crowd isn't using it as much.
It seems to me that right now the most popular thing is sharing videos, both 3rd party and original within various group chats.
I think there is social media platform overload, and the best way to keep in touch with people that actually matter to you and be sure they see your content is having group chats where you share things and then talk about it. Just my anecdotal observation, I'm probably wrong.
It seems similar to the resurgence of piracy now that there are 50+ different streaming apps.
It appears as though very few Hacker News commenters have spent any time using Tiktok. It is the only enjoyable, enriching social media service I've ever used. Most everything many of us liked about the old/weird internet is present on Tiktok right now: almost no ads or commercial presense, personal content from real people (not hyper produced productions from influencers and pros), weird content, niche content, organically viral content, positive/encouraging comment sections. I've been exposed to such a huge diversity of things on Tiktok: people with physical disabilities, hilarious and creative videos from high schoolers, an elementary school kids frog journal, dance videos with single-digit views, large engine repair tips, home improvement tips, pet ducks, absurdist memes. You owe it to yourself to not dismiss Tiktok as a time-waster for idle teens. Those positive aspects of Tiktok are something we should be figuring out how to expand elsewhere.
Too much focus on stars like Trevor Noah that gen Z / millennial didn't care about. Too "production"-y and "professional". Majority of content on TikTok feels more down to earth and relatable and actually interesting. It's the same reason why Vine was popular back in the day, it just felt more human instead of another entertainment product.
Since this forum brings out my inner contrarian, I feel compelled to defend TikTok. I can’t really argue with OP’s assessment of the manipulation built into the UX, but the rest misses the point. The point is the culture on TT is amazing. It’s format and anti-features may have something to do with it, or maybe it’s just the people and the momentum they set. It’s a place where polish isn’t expected, where the most popular content is just silly, unedited, and endearing. You’re more likely to see a person laying in bed with poor lighting than a studio. Their strict comment character count, terrible threading, lack of ability to browse user’s comment history, and no cumulative comment likes count all add up to an ephemeral stream of the tightest and cleverest showing up first. It’s stitch, duet, and video response features turn short form videos into a conversation, and I’ve enjoyed traversing many of such asynchronous dialogs. It’s a powerful authoring platform; it’s inline editing, face tracking filters, and media library make it so easy to make polished content. And it’s (musical.ly’s) original innovation of letting creators reuse each other’s sounds has had majestic results. Users can click on a sound and see dozens to thousands of different takes around the same audio; it’s exhilarating to see real diversity and iteration unfold around the same source material.
I disagree that the format is not educational. It has 3-10 min videos which are often richly packed with content and I’ve learned a tremendous amount from historians, reporters, scientists, and enthusiasts. I tend to bounce out to my browser a lot to dig deeper into a subject that I get tipped off about on TikTok.
The infamous FYP algorithm is its most popular and controversial feature. It’s a massive neutral net that tracks an insane amount of parameters, many of which you can only get with a video-feed-only platform. It’s been found to be effective at informally clustering people around medical conditions, sexual and political orientations, and more. It’s power of suggestion is terrifying. I’ve noticed a bias towards the more extreme left-wing views, perhaps as an antidote to YouTube’s alt-right pipeline, perhaps in as a subversive pro-CCP thrust. It’s easy to become entranced in a session and not realize that a post or series of them may have been fed with intent to influence a particular subject.
I’m still looking for the self-hosted, democratized antidote to TikTok; it’s just that it’s raised the bar so high for platform tools and spawned so many parasocial relationships that it feels insurmountable at times.
I would be remiss to not share some content. This video gave me a great chuckle today. Quintessential American TikTok humor, it’s a whole journey:
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRUevmRy/
Here is a creator that does a lot of conversational content. He talks about philosophy, category theory, his apartment decor, and queer aesthetic. This kind of eclecticism is mostly normal, and very different than YouTube’s highly thematic channels.
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRUevgky/
Finally, here is one of the news creators I follow. There are many wonderfully talented reporters that bring their own color. This one keeps it really straight: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRUdRMLT/?k=1
Definitely been a trend that professional content creation outperforms once the pros figure out how to game the algorithm. TikTok seems pretty resistant, both culturally and technologically. The shelf life of any one piece of content is so short that it might not be economical to invest too much in it. Instead you get a lot of fake amateur content, which is at least amusing.
I see similar arguments to this one a lot and frankly I don't see how anyone with an active social life can believe it to be true. The userbase for these platforms has massive crossover. Maybe it's a generational thing or something but I can gurantee you the socially active Gen Zers are on Insta and TikTok. If anything they'll be on both of those as well as Snapchat and Discord using each for particular types of social interaction. So the issue clearly isn't a locked in userbase.
So it must be the content creators right? But this is rediculous too! Because virtually every content creator worth a damn on TikTok will have a linked Instagram! What's more, many of them will often have a Linktree or similar url either in their profile description or linked on their insta that will include everything from YouTube, to Patreon, to OnlyFans. People who understand how to make money making content on these platforms aren't one trick ponies, they're using sophisticated marketing approaches that leverage the strengths of different online platforms to compensate for the fact they often have handle their own marketing.
So if the content of the knockoffs is bad or the creators arent finding the competition worth considering then the only question remaining I would argue is whether the problem is in the reccomendation system (TikTok was, and still is, famous with users for doing a solid job at this), the moderation system (TikTok, maybe because it's Chinese, is not so fixated on implementing the SJ nonsense that YouTube, FB, etc. pander to at the moderation level), or the compensation system (Again, probably because they care less about demonetizing you for wrongthink against whatever miniority or "important cause" is the pet of the week. Content competes primarily on its merits as likeable content).
In short, TikTok might have had an early mover advantage but the reason no one catches up in the current environment is because they can't get their heads out of the sand enough to realize it's their own fault no one entertaining wants to produce anything but TikTok reposts for them.
I share your enthusiasm for TikTok. It's the first social media app that felt like fun instead of an obligation. I have no doubt something will come along and ruin it (olds, monetization, acquisition). For now, it's really magical. It genuinely gives me hope for the next generation. They are impressively clever short-form story-tellers and continuously innovating techniques.
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