> EU is a vassal of the US (Pax America, which is a fairly ridiculous notion in and of itself).
You don't believe me? Perhaps Pax Americana needs to blow up another one of Europe's oil pipelines to remind you...
I wonder how long the sycophantic politicians can keep up the act before the freezing & unemployed citizens notice.
Here's a word of advice though, don't give the Nazis too many weapons. It may end up in a bad situation. They may hate Putin today, but tomorrow their prerogatives may change...
> It's time for the EU to either become a real institution or go away.
It is a real institution.
> Building an army and taking responsibility for its own defense is a step towards realism.
They are planning to create the army outside of the EU framework.
> She knows the US has little incentive to strong arm Russia into keeping the pipeline open.
Man, you really are uniformed about everything EU related. The US is trying to stop pipelines from Russia to Germany. The US doesn't want germany being reliant on russian gas. The US wants germany reliant on american gas. We are even planning on sanctioning companies working on building pipelines from russia to western europe.
> I see little downside to the improvement of global affairs with a stronger EU. Competition and self-sufficient agents are always good.
If you think competition and self-sufficieny are always good, shouldn't you be against the EU? The EU is the opposite of competition and self-sufficiency. It's 28 nations cooperating rather than competing and becoming dependent rather than self-sufficient.
That's the first point you deny: Russia have COUNTLESS reasons to invade, reasons built by NATO for their proxy war they need. Why? Because us in the EU have started to accept friendly proposals from our fellow Europeans (geographically Europe arrive till the Urals, Russia is vast but Moscow is an European capital) to unite: we have the best tech in the world (while we keep demolishing it) they have the biggest natural resources.
UK knows being not an empire anymore, USA knows their power is just an industrial-military power in deep cyclic decline so they need to go to war, if they loose Europe they loose anything. If Russia and Europe form the long discussed EAEU we will be the first world power again and China and USA/UK can only kill themselves as we did in the '900 with WWI and WWII witch equal results: becoming satellites of the new old world power.
So, as written black on white on OUR and USA public governmental document, I cited some and invited you to read them, they create coups to put in power anglophone-élite friendly nazi militias managing to push Russia to react to stop an European renaissance and that's NOT Putin propaganda, that's written by EU OSCE and USA RAND public reports.
In that case the invasion is just a logic and well warned in advance consequence any country in the human history have done as needed, while stealing is an act of thief, pure and simple.
> Then you say EU and US are not to be trusted because they are "stealing", and that it's better to trust Russia.
Not really: it's better to choose reliable partners who what they say vs a neoliberal criminal nazi elite who keep devastating our world in various waves. Honestly my personal vision is: we from EU need to jail for life in so harsh conditions our ruling class from the public and the private part for high treason, crimes against humanity, embezzlement and many other crimes. We need to declare neliberals for what they are: criminals, son of those liberals who create nazism and fascism in the '900, banned for life from humanity, declare the actual USA, UK, Canada ruling class criminals against humanity to be jailed if they ever enter our territory, forming a real EU (that's already there in young people mind) annihilating the actual scam economy of private money and private-public partnerships and offering Russian fed. a partnership: we gives you tech, you gives us natural resources and we will push toward substantial democracy against formal ones. USA and UK peoples should revolt against their oppressors who made them poor and poorest for their own sake and start to form new governments, again from substantial democracy not formal one, seen their actual dire situation with a New Deal not green but Roosveltian ones.
> For all the bad that the US does, at least they don't invade and annex European countries, and try to undermine European politics.
Another German here. I find Putin and Russia absolutely revolting, but that last part is utter propaganda. The US has meddled in European politics for decades - just take Trump's stupid whining against BMW or Bush/Obama's complaints about NATO budget or us Germans not joining the fun in Iraq.
> Do you not realise the US is the only reason Europe doesn't enjoy friendly relations with Russia
Is because Russia does not have friends. If you think buying his hydrocarbons and shutting up about him being fascist would make you Putin's friend - you've got some bad news coming. Putin doesn't want friends. He wants power. If he can use some useful idiots from the West (like certain German politicians) to gain more power - he will use them. The rest of the Germans are paying for it now.
> might j-u-s-t p-o-s-s-i-b-l-y be because it's actually you who are the 'Baddies'
We considered the possibility, and it's not true. Putin attacked Georgia in 2008, Putin attacked Ukraine in 2014, Putin is attacking Ukraine right now. It's that simple. There are evil people around, and sometimes evil people capture power in some countries. It happened in Germany. It happened in (half of) Korea. It happened in Iran. Now it happened in Russia.
> not [at one time or another] everyone else on the fucking planet!
Everyone else on the fucking planet did not invade Ukraine. Putin did.
> if EU leadership was competent, they'd do the thing that USA is most afraid of.. talk to putin and make a strong europe.
Wow Just wow. Ready to place responsibility at everyone but Russia's feet right? Such a blameless third party victim in all of this /s.
The pipeline itself was in good part Merkel's olive branch to connect Putin economically to the rest of the EU. The hope was that giving Russia more to lose would prevent these conflicts. Sure the US, among others, we're wary of this kind of interdependence.
Well, now we know how things shook out and we're all dealing with it. Germany from the back foot this round.
Now I'm not attributing any great foresight to naysayers (US among them), it was a nobel bid for peace on Germany's part and there's always a chance we'd be talking about the brilliance of deepening those connections with Russia.
But we can't.
Russia drove its tanks into Ukraine, nobody made them. They weren't under any great duress. Even the most unjustifiably charitable take of Russian justification accounts for what, just Luhansk and Donetsk? But they tried to take Kiev. Tried to take every bit of Ukrainian's coastline with the Black Sea through Odessa. Russia good out of it's way to poison their reputation here with conquest.
> Trying to curb Russia during the war the best they can.
> Because we need not to forget that Europe is at war
Europe is not at war. Or at least it wasn't until some politicians decided it was their business to intervene in somebody else's war. This is certainly against their own citizen.
I am an EU citizen myself and I did not consent to join this war.
> Not predicting Russian Imperial dreams of ruling the Europe?
Sorry, but that was never the case and will never be the case.
> Throwing nuclear out the window and becoming so dependent on Russian gas?
Bingo! However, that was not Russia's fault. It was definitely self-sabotage.
> I believe it is an overtly hostile action against EU citizens and, particularly, Germans, who will suffer the most economically.
In the scenario where America did it, I think there is a strong argument to be made that it was in the long-term interests of EU citizens, despite causing them some short-term discomfort. They never should have started this pipeline project in the first place, buying energy from Russia made the EU weak. Breaking that relationship permanently will make the EU stronger.
> The comparison between Putin and Hitler is ridiculous.
And yet, here we are with another ultranationalist dictator hell bent on getting back that vital space and dreaming of fallen empires. Hitler had Charlemagne, and Putin has Catherine and Peter the Great. Putin did not gas anybody that I know of, but the gulags remained the whole time. It’s true that he is closer to Stalin than Hitler in many respects, but I am not sure it’s much better.
> Europe’s economy is in shambles, they do not have the power to push back if Russia and the US were to push for détente never mind that the country with the most EU influence (Germany) is a major dove on this issue.
That is a terrible misreading of how the EU functions. By design it cannot be dominated by a single country and Germany is basically following others. It’s not a major dove in any way, it’s just in the middle of the pack and they started from a fundamentally pacifist political background. The fact that they are merely talking about rearming is a demonstration of the seismic shift in domestic politics there.
Détente won’t happen in the current situation, regardless of what the US push for. They simply have no power to force that outcome. What would happen is another Korea, Georgia or Moldova: a country split in two, with one half living under yet another brutal dictatorship.
>The call for NATO to act just further embarrasses the EU
Haha exactly what i was thinking, maybe ask china too if they can help ;)
>How can they even consider a natural gas pipeline with Russia invading Ukraine less than 10 years ago and amassing nearly 100000 troops on the border today?
But that's where you are wrong, russia cannot accept that the nato places it's rockets into Ukraine, the US=NATO pushed russia into those steps.
> What EU lacks is offensive overseas operation support, but EU actually doesn’t need that. It is wild fantasy from the most extreme EU supporters who want to build a US replica.
You could just as well say "Not wanting it is a wild fantasy from the most extreme RT supporters who don't care if the EU is overrun by dictatorships on its eastern borders".
> What is the biggest threat to EU/Europe today? Definitely not Russia. Russia is just finishing the Nordstream2 pipeline,
Precisely that is probably the biggest threat to EU/Europe today.
> sanctions just lifted by the Biden administration,
Maybe Unca Joe really is going senile.
> that will increase the capacity of the already existing pipeline between Russia and Germany. Russia wants to sell natural gas to many European countries.
Yes, it wants to have them all...
> What we are going to see the next few years is the opposite, a closer integration between Russia and EU economies,
Russia has already explicitly used energy blackmail on EU nations, and is specifically pushing Nordstream, etc. pipelines to create such dependency. Most recently Russia broke it's contracts and demanded payment in Rubles in order to support it's currency after launching a genocidal attack on it's neighbor.
US policy has been explicitly AGAINST even allowing exports for decades, and only relaxed recently in order to support our EU friends.
Russia is an entirely unreliable supplier, the US is reliable.
Take your new troll account and go back to Leningrad, Boris.
> Europeans don't hate Russians as much as Americans do
I don't think Americans hate Russians at all, in my experience. Just Putin and a handful of oligarchs.
> probably because they've actually got Russians visiting and know that Russia doesn't really represent the threat that the American military-industrial complex needs you to believe is real in order to justify their trillion dollar misadventures and further subjugation of NATO member states into puppetry.
Some of these Russians just happen to carry Novichok or polonium and assassinate dissidents living in Europe, no big deal right?
> In fact, a lot of Europeans would like to see peace made with Russia. A Europe united with Russia would be the one superpower even China could do little to contain ..
>The US owes its status as a superpower primarily to most of Europe wearing itself out in the two world wars.
Sure, but US did not start WW1 or WW2, but European powers did. In fact, US were mostly neutral for a long time in both wars, only entering last minute. Don't forget that European powers also tried to capitalize on the US civil war way back when. It's just business, nothing personal.
The EU cold have also been better prepared for this by investing more into local defense and energy sector starving Russia of any leverage.
But EU chose instead to rely on idealistic hippie dreams by halting nuclear development, lowering defense spending and suckling on the sweet Russian gas teat, letting its former leaders become highly paid lobbyists for Russian oil and gas companies when their terms were over. The situation the EU finds itself in is entirely of its own making, like that meme with the cyclist who shoves a stick in the front wheel of his bicycle while he rides it and then blames someone else for his fall. The US is not at fault here, in fact, they even warned the EU several times of over reliance on Russia for energy and Germany scoffed it off. And I say this as an European.
EU needs to snap back to reality and get its act together tackling pressing issues (Russia, China, energy, debt, housing, tech, environment, illegal migration) based on what's happening in the real world around them, not based on some hippie ideologies of the far left who live in Cloud Cuckoo Land.
> The truth is Europe is utterly helpless militarily. They can't defend against Russian action in Eastern Europe without American military power.
If you paid any attention to recent weeks, it would have occurred to you that the rest of Europe would obliterate Russian forces if Russia dared to attack with its absolutely inept ground forces.
You don't believe me? Perhaps Pax Americana needs to blow up another one of Europe's oil pipelines to remind you...
I wonder how long the sycophantic politicians can keep up the act before the freezing & unemployed citizens notice.
Here's a word of advice though, don't give the Nazis too many weapons. It may end up in a bad situation. They may hate Putin today, but tomorrow their prerogatives may change...
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