It sounds like you're suggesting that people eat as much salt as they like. Where's the harm in cutting back on the salt?
I agree with you that a lot of our diets (especially fad diets) are based on little to no science. At best, they're based on incomplete science. But what dietary guidelines would you recommend to someone?
Personally, I try to follow Michael Pollen's advice (Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants.), whether or not it's based in complete science. Because with diet, one can't simply wait for science to settle things out.
That's cool, I mean definitely do what is best for you. I think there is a lot of room for self-discovery of our own optimal diets. The salt debate is one of those things where nutrition science can't seem to settle on it, depending on the survey.
I agree that dietary research needs to continue but I think the back and forth about what to eat (saturated vs non saturated, no salt vs salt ok etc) needs to slow down. I think the best advice is that by Michael Pollan "Eat food, not too much, mostly plants."
I'm waiting for the day that nutricionists find out that there are different kinds of people with different nutritional needs. Imposing rules on the population on a weak scientific basis harms the people, science and the government in the process.
Currently the best way to consume food is to avoid addictive and highly processed food products and then trust your gut with the rest. Eat what you like and avoid what causes problems. Use salt to taste, most likely it won't kill you - else we would have found out already.
My point is that people who avoid entire food groups, or foods that have one particular nutrient usually have very strange reasons to do so, that border on the metaphysical and are routinely misguided. Like the carnivore diet, or the various macrobiotic diets, for example.
But strangely those weird diets never center around cutting salt out (and some of the meat-only diets are also deliberately heavy in fats). My intuition is that this is because salt is almost addictive, because it is so tastey, and it is very, very difficult to get people to reduce salt in their diet, despite the damage it can cause.
Anyway it's still the case that none of my doctors or nurses have advised me to cut down on oxalate-heavy foods to avoid kidney stones, so I don't think you need to worry that much. If there is a risk, it's a risk only when considered at a population level and probably very low at an individual level.
Not that it will harm you to eat fewer potatoes. They're mostly starch anyway and I think at this point everyone agrees that too much starch can be a problem (because gaining weight is all too easy even without excess starch).
I'm happy to settle for Michael Pollan's advice:
"Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants."
Although I admit I don't follow that as closely as a maybe should. Sure, it would be nice to have some better science in this area. But I think eating a wide variety of food in moderation is enough to keep us generally healthy (the flaw being that Americans are absolutely terrible at doing anything in moderation).
I think after the last few years of these kinds of things coming out, the takeaway is pretty simple: be fairly sceptical of 'advice' coming out of large governing bodies and instead just be sensible.
Don't eat too much food. Limit processed foods. Eat lots of fruit and vegetables. Eat a large variety of foods. Be active.
These rudimentary guidelines are clearly difficult for a lot of people to follow, but I think it's pretty easy to avoid negative diet effects by just doing what most people intuitively know as the right thing, even if we consume some of all types of food. It seems to me this is more about self-control and effort level than any scientific knowledge, at this point.
One odd aspect is that all these 'recommendations' adopted en masse (low salt, low cholesterol, low fat) are based on the goal of avoiding heart problems. I guess it makes sense as a goal but not sure it makes sense to go in reverse from that goal, using very unsound studies, to come up with these restrictive rules of thumb for everyone... like oh, just reduce the salt in this meal and you'll be okay. Indeed such approaches can be described as superstition.
I'm surprised that you are so naive about what being "science-minded" on this issue means. There is so much variation in human physiology and digestive tract composition that a universal "healthy" diet is probably even more backwards of a notion than the USDA recommendations. What will be best for you to eat needs to be determined by your experiments with various different diets and will depend on how much you exercise and many other factors. Until we understand more about the bacteria that live in our body and how we interact with them, "science" is not going to be any better than folk wisdom. There is nothing wrong with eating the foods that have proven to work over 100,000+ years of human society.
I see several themes in the advice on this thread - don't eat too much, eat whole foods, and drink water. I have to say that this is probably the most scientific advice you will find.
My bullshit detector is pinging wildly on the linked diet. Gluten-free, measured salt intake, 6 glasses of water per day, and the list goes on. No thanks — I'll take my diet advice from people that follow the science, not pop trends.
Our knowledge of more than coarse grained dietary needs and effects is grossly overestimated. That vacuum is exploited by commercial interests that typically vilify any form of consumption moderation, and focus instead on promoting one (over)consumption pattern over another.
"Eat lots of different things in moderation because honestly we do not know in enough detail what we need" is sound advice, but sadly just benefits the "patient" and not some profit maximizing economic lobby group.
100% agree with you. If you listen to what food scientists are actually saying, they're almost always espousing fractional improvements with small tweaks to diets and the media runs with "You should stop eating X because Y" or "You should only eat Z" stories.
Any dietitian will tell you, the key to a healthy diet is moderation and variety.
I agree. It’s true of many (all?) diets that its proponents tend to overestimate the applicability of any one diet to all people.
Dietary science is at its infancy. Contrary to what most people would assume, we have mountains of anecdotes, mountains of opinions, and very few hard facts. Navigating diet from a fact-first, science-first perspective is deeply frustrating.
I'm glad there are controlled studies that are documented so that we can have this discussion meaningfully and attempt to sequester the quacks.
There's a reason why we have chi-squared and T-tests, and an entire branch of math dedicated to statistical analysis for empirical studies. (And please don't quote Mark Twain, someone always does...)
That being said, I think the meta-analysis of decades of research is showing diet science is complicated a/f. It would not surprise me of we ultimately can create bespoke diets since we all are complex machines and different environments.
For anyone who's never heard, Michal Pollan has 7 great rules, but there's one golden rule:
"Eat food, Not too much, Mostly plants."
Here are the more "controversial" 7.
1. Don't eat anything your great grandmother wouldn't recognize as food. "When you pick up that box of portable yogurt tubes, or eat something with 15 ingredients you can't pronounce, ask yourself, "What are those things doing there?" Pollan says.
2. Don’t eat anything with more than five ingredients, or ingredients you can't pronounce.
3. Stay out of the middle of the supermarket; shop on the perimeter of the store. Real food tends to be on the outer edge of the store near the loading docks, where it can be replaced with fresh foods when it goes bad.
4. Don't eat anything that won't eventually rot. "There are exceptions -- honey -- but as a rule, things like Twinkies that never go bad aren't food," Pollan says.
5. It is not just what you eat but how you eat. "Always leave the table a little hungry," Pollan says. "Many cultures have rules that you stop eating before you are full. In Japan, they say eat until you are four-fifths full. Islamic culture has a similar rule, and in German culture they say, 'Tie off the sack before it's full.'"
6. Families traditionally ate together, around a table and not a TV, at regular meal times. It's a good tradition. Enjoy meals with the people you love. "Remember when eating between meals felt wrong?" Pollan asks.
7. Don't buy food where you buy your gasoline. In the U.S., 20% of food is eaten in the car.
As true as that is, it is remarkably hard to get evidence-based, clear guidance on what to eat and not eat.
That's in part because food is extremely complex, so it's hard to isolate nutritional factors.
It can be done to some degree, but it's hard. There are some best practices for how to pursue it, but it tends to not get recognized as a legitimate approach because it falls outside the way science is typically done.
This is not feasible advice. I can't read studies and correctly interpret and summarize them in every area of science which could affect my day-to-day decisions. That's insane.
But if you wanted to study something out and make your own decision, you should be free to do so.
I think nutrition is a great example. Despite decades of research, there appears to be no one single answer as to what constitutes a healthy diet, or what the most important aspects of a healthy diet are.
As an individual, you have lots of choices, including eating whatever you want with no particular dietary plan at all. But if you want to read a book or read research papers and change your diet, you can.
This does not surprise me, nor does "lack of x will kill you" and the same goes for "too much of x will harm you". Just do things in moderation, or do what you feel you need. Our bodies seem to be pretty smart and often work themselves out - so just listen to it. If you feel tired, go to sleep. If you're hungry, then eat.
For biologists and doctors, it might be fun/interesting to study but for the rest of us I think we should just use common sense and listen to our bodies. I personally abhor these "fads".
I agree with you that a lot of our diets (especially fad diets) are based on little to no science. At best, they're based on incomplete science. But what dietary guidelines would you recommend to someone?
Personally, I try to follow Michael Pollen's advice (Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants.), whether or not it's based in complete science. Because with diet, one can't simply wait for science to settle things out.
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