Awhile back I was this fat, neckbearded kid in my mothers basement coding and gaming. Realized I'm trash at interacting on the most basic levels with people. Lost all the weight, got strong, got decently good looking, but inside I'm always still that shy nerd that doesn't really want to go out ever and keep to himself.
Every outing I need to mentally and physically prepare for, I can't just "go out" and be with people. I have to pay active attention to how my face feels, what position I'm sitting in, how I'm walking, the spacing between my steps, my pacing, every little detail is calculated and it makes going out extremely difficult.
Every single day is a mission to fake it, and though I'm good at it now and it's nearly natural, I still microanalyze every person, gesture, blink, speech, walk, turn, movement of everyone and I incorporate these attributes into my own outward image to project confidence, courage, and ambition.
I never had friends growing up when I was young, not sure what kind of impact that truly had but as an outsider, I've been observing relentlessly, almost obsessively, and taking bits and pieces from others until I formed someone decent (me), how normal people act in normal situations.
I still feel extremely anxious every day to the point of having to pep talk myself before meeting someone, that has never changed for a second, the only thing that has changed is my ability to mask it but I'm as scared as ever.
It makes me wonder if everyone is in the same shoes.
I'm a person that can't do anything unless a process, or number, is attached to it. Essays in highschool? Barely ever passed, I lock down, don't know where to start. Math? Design? Computers? Not the slightest problem, which is why human interaction is so difficult, there is no "set way" to interact.
I don't really know who I truly am because all my mannerisms are borrowed from various people, movies, figures, friends. No movement or expression is my own and it's difficult to cope with.
Through my observation, the only thing that honestly matters, is just being nice and treating others as equals and it all falls into place.
I don't know if it's mental illness or what it is, but I can tell you right now the happiest I'd ever be is 100% alone left to my own mind somewhere deep in nature.
I remember having a heart to heart with roommates I was "close" with. We started talking about all our passive aggressiveness because it was starting to get to all of us and ruin our living situation. It got way to real, and then it got to me. I explained to them how I see the world, how I deal with things, and they honestly looked kinda terrified and thought I was crazy, and it hasn't really been the same since then since they don't really know who I am now, I don't even know who I am.
Almost identical to my behavior a few years back. Changed a lot since but still too much on the 'computed behavior' side of things.
2 cents analysis on things: with objects I can try fail and try again with no fear of hurting (both ways) or trying again, and most things I learn is relatively stable, with people everything is very informal, random, ad-hoc, arbitrary, absurd. It's hard to keep in mind the small but valuable beauty of relating to someone, it's often under a fat layer of "fakery" but it seems they all click, admit and understand it while I drown under this accidental complexity.
It's hard to keep in mind the small but valuable beauty of relating to someone, it's often under a fat layer of "fakery" but it seems they all click, admit and understand it while I drown under this accidental complexity.
I can safely say I've never related to a single person I've met, I just kind of see through them. Sure I can laugh at your jokes and share stories but I still feel as though I'm in a one man gallery and you're all on display.
And what about after the fact ? I'm so anxious around people I can't reach emotional responses but later on I do feel for some, it's just something somehow too private, too sensitive.
When you sit in class, or say, on the bus, do you usually go for the back seat, behind everyone, where no one can see you?
Maybe you have social anxiety (or anxiety in general) which what makes it painful going out and interacting with other people.
Regarding the inability to write essays, I also have that problem where I feel like nothing is coming to me and I don't really know how to start. I have recently been tested and it appears that I have a learning disability (something memory related).
Yes I sit in the back all the time. It's weird, if you met me, I'm the most confident/nice/happy person to hang out with, but it's all absolutely fake and orchestrated, and borrowed, and I can even tell you which features are from who! Ideally I'd throw on my default face all day but nobody likes that, I just look super pissed off.
How do you get tested/evaluated? Yeah I have social anxiety for sure.
1. If your "default face" is being super pissed off all the time, it means you're probably having larger problems on top of social anxiety. Apart from genetics (some people are just less/more cheerful than others), there must be factors in your life which make you like that - try to identify them.
2. There are people who prefer interacting with others' "natural face", even if it is to some extent not attractive (not everything needs to be TV-show attractive! quirkiness can make you interesting to others), to interacting with a "happy drone". Talking to "happy drones" feel like watching a commercial.
You need to look for a decent psychiatrist. By the way, there is no magic fix for anxiety. The non-medication route might use CBT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_behavioral_therapy) and the meds that are usually prescribed are anti-depressants.
I also have social anxiety (a mild form of it), that makes me a little awkward around people, and makes my heart rate go through the roof when I need to speak publicly (for example, asking a question in a large class). I was offered to take anti-depressants, but I chose not to because I feel that I can deal with it without any meds.
"Fake it till you become it." This is the path I've been on for the last 5 years, and only now am I finally starting to feel a little "natural" in some core social competencies.
But man is it exhausting! All the micromangaging, analyzing, calibrating, and mental preparation. I often require more sleep as a result, guess the brain needs that to adapt.
I relate to a lot of this. I used to have similar traits.
Then I bought a bar--a little neighborhood bar, where it's slow--and worked behind the bar for two years.
It fixed me. Now I feel relaxed just to be me.
I don't think everyone can spend two years behind a bar, but maybe there's something similar you can do. For me it was just lots of forced interaction with all levels of acquaintance, for hours per day, until I became good at social interaction and began to relax.
+1 to this. I moved to Manchester a couple of years after uni to help the startup I was working for expand into the UK market. I spent the first year either at my day job or in my room wondering how to make friends. One day I walked past a tiny Aussie bar that had recently opened in Chorlton and impulsively walked in and asked for a job. The world opened up to me while working behind that bar. I became friends with so many wonderful people I never would have met if I hadn't taken that single step. At first I was petrified talking to customers but gradually the fear wore off and I was all of a sudden wheeling people out of that place in wheelie bins and organising lock ins with half the clientele.
Actually, the more I think about it, the more I realise that bar job was the difference between having the time of my life and wasting my entire two years worth of social life. Maybe it was the Manchester vibe but people just seemed to want a bartender in their life.
In my personal experience, faking has been helpful.
I also grew up mostly without friends. The weirdest thing for me though was that as a toddler, I was extremely social and friendly. Then through a series of occurrences I ended up on the other end of the spectrum. My family moved all the time and I barely ever had any friends. I was happiest when reading. I read incessantly, constantly - often hiding in the bathroom to read because my mom wanted me to do school work. Haha.
It was strange though because I read fiction exclusively. It was a way for me to find friends, even though fake ones.
I left home in grade 11 (Junior year of high school) for a boarding school. I was super excited to make hundreds of friends now that I was finally going to be among more people my age, living with them. It turned out to be a disaster. I had always wanted friends but I had never learned to socialize. It was a hard 2 years of rejection, pranks, people constantly laughing at me. In a high end school in Delhi girls who don't know how to dress, do their hair, take care of themselves, are BIG jokes. :-/ To be fair, I was not smoothest operator aside from that either.
After that I got into Stanford for college and that was probably the biggest blessing I got. Suddenly I was around people who were more like me. Yay! But I faked a lot to fit in and be "normal". I tried really hard to be interesting. I still only managed to make a few friends but I wasn't a pariah.
Then desire struck. I decided I wanted to fulfill my dream of being a "leader" and ran for student government. That was one of the times in my life that I faked it till I made it. I was the friendliest, best looking self I have ever been. As I was going through the election campaign, I wondering if this faking was worth it.
I didn't really realize then but that experience changed me forever. The faking stopped feeling fake. I now feel much more empathetic and social with people. Similar to the person who commented below about running a bar to change his behavior and comfort level, its almost like I needed practice to civilize myself haha.
Anyway, in summary, I feel like faking is shitty when you are going through it but can have really good long term behavior changes. Its all about emulating the right behaviors.
Quite a few misconceptions here, that I'm surprised no one else has picked up on.
>Awhile back I was this fat, neckbearded kid in my mothers basement coding and gaming. Realized I'm trash at interacting on the most basic levels with people. Lost all the weight, got strong, got decently good looking,
You took action! That is something to be proud of. So, so, so many people never take action. They think they can't change, they think that's simply the 'way they are'.
>Every outing I need to mentally and physically prepare for, I can't just "go out" and be with people.
Isn't this a bit obvious? Seriously, what are you expecting? Do you think a person that has used a computer a couple of times in their lives is going to feel secure & confident. Do you think they will know all the shortcuts, know what to do and when, do you think everything will come naturally to them?
Of course not! Using computers, just like interacting socially, is a _skill_. Skills take practice. Being a social butterfly is not "normal". What is normal is that people who practice a skill gradually become better at it. So accept that you have not put in as many hours into social interactions as some other people. But you can, and it seems that you're catching up.
>I don't really know who I truly am because all my mannerisms are borrowed from various people, movies, figures, friends. No movement or expression is my own and it's difficult to cope with.
Your "own"? Everyone takes the things they do and know from people around it. Just because you're doing this at a point in your life where you're consciously aware of it, doesn't make it "worth any less" or weird.
I'm only replying because I can identify 100% with what you said. I do the same things, micro-analysing what everyone else is doing? Yep. Feeling insecure around other people? Yep. Wanting to be alone? Yep. Not feeling "normal"? Yep.
I think the only difference is that I'm pushing to accept who I am. (I am who I am, there's reason why I am the way I am, and that's ok. Negative self-talk will harm, rather than help me.) There is no "normal". Everyone is insecure to some extent. You can become less insecure by practice whatever you're insecure at.
Go see a psychiatrist. They will be able to help you. If you're not opposed to them, psychedelics have also helped me (personally with some aspects of this)
Wow, I've experienced a lot of that and have been trying to describe it to those around me. They're are all supportive, but I don't know whether they really understand what I am saying.
I don't dance, because I am afraid of being judged the way I analyze others. I don't show emotion or affection (much, I am a lot older and a little better now) in public, for the same reason. I remember every single time I've attempted a social interaction and it went poorly -- they stick with me more than anything else. When I see someone naturally at ease, I am immediately envious and trying to glean any hints of how I should act. I also feel like a construct of all those people around me -- I can look back over the last 20 years and see the phases of my life. It's like I became different people in different places, different jobs. Whatever it took to be normal, to fit in.
I don't know about others, but you're not alone. It made me feel better reading your comment and knowing I am not alone. Thank you.
Awhile back I was this fat, neckbearded kid in my mothers basement coding and gaming. Realized I'm trash at interacting on the most basic levels with people. Lost all the weight, got strong, got decently good looking, but inside I'm always still that shy nerd that doesn't really want to go out ever and keep to himself.
Every outing I need to mentally and physically prepare for, I can't just "go out" and be with people. I have to pay active attention to how my face feels, what position I'm sitting in, how I'm walking, the spacing between my steps, my pacing, every little detail is calculated and it makes going out extremely difficult.
Every single day is a mission to fake it, and though I'm good at it now and it's nearly natural, I still microanalyze every person, gesture, blink, speech, walk, turn, movement of everyone and I incorporate these attributes into my own outward image to project confidence, courage, and ambition.
I never had friends growing up when I was young, not sure what kind of impact that truly had but as an outsider, I've been observing relentlessly, almost obsessively, and taking bits and pieces from others until I formed someone decent (me), how normal people act in normal situations.
I still feel extremely anxious every day to the point of having to pep talk myself before meeting someone, that has never changed for a second, the only thing that has changed is my ability to mask it but I'm as scared as ever.
It makes me wonder if everyone is in the same shoes.
I'm a person that can't do anything unless a process, or number, is attached to it. Essays in highschool? Barely ever passed, I lock down, don't know where to start. Math? Design? Computers? Not the slightest problem, which is why human interaction is so difficult, there is no "set way" to interact.
I don't really know who I truly am because all my mannerisms are borrowed from various people, movies, figures, friends. No movement or expression is my own and it's difficult to cope with.
Through my observation, the only thing that honestly matters, is just being nice and treating others as equals and it all falls into place.
I don't know if it's mental illness or what it is, but I can tell you right now the happiest I'd ever be is 100% alone left to my own mind somewhere deep in nature.
I remember having a heart to heart with roommates I was "close" with. We started talking about all our passive aggressiveness because it was starting to get to all of us and ruin our living situation. It got way to real, and then it got to me. I explained to them how I see the world, how I deal with things, and they honestly looked kinda terrified and thought I was crazy, and it hasn't really been the same since then since they don't really know who I am now, I don't even know who I am.
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