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Valid points, but also you don't have to pay maintenance expenses or property taxes on your REIT.


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How is this better than just renting and also putting some money into a reit each month?

Edit: I suppose one reason would be if you want to rent, but you like a house that's not on the rental market. Any others?


Yeah, go buy a REIT or a housing-related stock. Then you haev all the investment benefits of owning a house EXCEPT - you don't have to pay extra taxes - no maintenance - you can sell any second you want. So go figure.

"For instance, buy an index with a low maintenance fee that tracks the REIT."

That throws the calculation way off, because you don't get the tax benefits associated with buying and living in a house.


But owning a REIT is nothing like owning property. Sure, REITs and investment properties both derive cash flows from rent, but the similarities stop there.

In general, asking “why not X instead of Y” without giving reasons why X is preferable over Y is just a waste of everyone’s time.


Still doesn't offer that tax advantage (either in capital gains or the numerous deductions). And if you have to live somewhere like the parent comment, this doesn't help you.

You will have a commission in the expense ratio indefinitely.

But yes, definitely a decent option if you want to put your money in real estate with less headache.


There are very specific reasons a house is a better investment than an REIT.

1. Taxes - There are tax breaks to owning 2. Property Management - For an REIT you pay a property manager. If you own, no need to manage your property. Free +1.2% return on asset! 3. Loans are heavily subsidized by the government, REITs cannot get 30 year loans at 3-4% interest. 4. Occupancy - You live here. Occupancy rate 100% so take an +.6% to returns!

If the government stopped 1 and 3, technology completely automated 2, and leases were 4 years long. Then no one would recommend buying your own house as an investment.


A balanced portfolio consisting of REITs, ETFs, & Bonds is easily performing above 7% in Canada.

But the post does seem extremely naive. What it costs to maintain real estate (property tax, maintenance, insurance, etc) makes even typically criminally-high mutual fund fees seem reasonable. Even if owning real estate really floats your boat why wait in fear for the next 2am call to fix a flooded basement when you can get a check every month from a REIT which being a dividend is taxed at less than half the rate of a rent income (which will likely be taxed at your highest marginal rate)?


The benefits of investing in individual properties are:

- Other people's money (leverage via loan)

- Tax write-offs (interest deduction, expense shelter, depreciation).

- Appreciation.

- Equity growth.

- Rental income.

The first two probably can't be obtained via REIT.


I personally don't want the headaches of being a landlord, but I have invested in apartment real-estate investment trusts (REITs). Such REITs do build housing, and I think that without them, housing costs would be even higher.

Correct!

But, more fun math:

Stocks don't have maintenance costs like houses/rental units. The property tax alone per year on a ~$500k place is ~$8k. (You'd need to get $700/month in rent JUST to cover property tax.) (The next buyer, at 1.4M valuation, would need to charge ~$2k/month JUST to cover the prop tax, nothing else!)

Add in ~$2k/year in regular maintenance, + ~$30k of maintenance every ~5-10 years (roofs, flooring, bathroom fixtures, appliances all die someday), and renting not so profitable. Reliable capital appreciation is the bigger, pure profit here.


Two reasons: leverage and taxes.

With REITs, there is typically no leverage and the dividends are taxed as ordinary income. If you invest in real estate directly, you can borrow at low rates and the tax treatment is better through deductions, depreciation, 1031 exchange, etc.


I've been invested in REITs for a while, but I've more seriously been looking at direct investments because I've realized that REITs actually behave quite a bit differently from owning real estate.

(Traditional) REITs are priced more or less like a bond by the markets and will be largely evaluated based on their yield. As a result, you're missing out on the appreciation component of real estate. You also don't get the tax benefits of the interest deduction. With a direct investment, you can look at things like which areas will disproportionately appreciate in the future. It's more like an active investment in a value stock with a nice dividend to boot.


You can't get a mortgage to invest in REITs. Also you can't live in your REIT investment, so you still have to pay rent.

Of course if you have an investment portfolio adding an RETI is probably a good idea, but it's not really comparable to investing in actual real estate.


Not to mention that by owning you have to pay property tax, which should be considered when comparing investment returns.

One thing to always consider is that even when the housing market makes money there are ways to benefit from it without owning a house.

For instance, buy an index with a low maintenance fee that tracks the REIT. It's also a lot quicker (and easier) to get out of that index fund than it is to get out of your home. https://personal.vanguard.com/us/FundsSnapshot?FundId=0123&#...

The key is, you can invest in real estate without owning a home and better still: be diversified into multiple kinds of real estate. A home is a very homogeneous investment vehicle. Think of it more like a savings account with a maintenance fee but you can live inside it.


Safer, maybe, but nothing beats truly owning real estate.

I have a few rental properties, all managed by a property management co.

I can cash out re-fi and roll it into another property tax free, rinse and repeat. Buy > Rehab > Rent > Refinance > Repeat.

I can take the property and sell if it appreciates.

I can do a 1031 tax exchange for a similar property.

Or I can just continue to rent it out.

Best part is I can use other people's money as leverage to buy much more property, and if the deal makes sense at the time of purchase/deal analysis, I won't be over-leveraged and will stand to make money, with multiple exits as options.

After paying off the note, I can seller finance it to someone (rent-to-own) if I wish, at whatever interest rate I/my buyer deems appropriate.

Can't do that with REITs, unfortunately. But in terms of being truly passive, REITs fit the bill!


Very interesting, thanks!

I suppose that some of the big benefits of home ownership (mortgage interest/local tax deduction, capital gains exemption) are not available with Arrived?

These benefits are not available with REITs, and REITs have to pay out most of their earnings as dividends.

Is Arrived classified as a REIT?


I can invest in a lot more rental markets and manage idiosyncratic risk. Plus I don't have to deal with maintenance issues with physical property upkeep.

I have also invested in vehicles (private offerings) that fund residential construction especially in housing constrained markets. Very nice reliable returns


Point taken, but I'd value my (and everyone else's) personal judgment when it comes to property investment higher than investing in a REIT simply because I have more insight into what I'm buying and have the ability to personally improve my asset by taking good care of it, making improvements and getting involved in my community. Owning a home isn't all that different than running a small business in that way.
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