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My favorite yojijukugo is from Chinese, despite the fact that I barely speak it.

????, or “Pushing forward to better yourself without ceasing,” I think? Maybe there’s a better way to put it?

Another poster mentioned ???? which is my second favorite. It puts things in perspective quite well.



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Some that I like:

???? (issekinichou ; literally: one stone, two birds ; I'll let you guess the meaning (yes, it's very close to an expression in English))

???? (jigoujitoku ; reap what you sow)

???? (jisakujien ; self-made self-staged ; for example, used for the act of creating a staged situation and then acting as if it were genuine)

???? (jimonjitou ; answering one's own question)

???? (jiboujiki ; self-abandonment)

???? (jigajisan ; singing one's own praises)

???? (jikyuujisoku ; self-sufficiency)

???? (jiyuujizai ; free/unrestricted)

(Yeah, I have a thing for the ???? ones)


Which word are you referring to? I have limited knowledge of Japanese, but I’m fluent in Chinese so I’m curious if a similar word or usage exists.

I see. Having no knowledge of Japanese, I found it interesting. Coming from China, I could say that both Mandarin and Cantonese have popular literal translations for the expression, albeit most Chinese find it cheesy and prefer to use English instead.

My favorite is Japanese sayoonara: "if it must be that way"

An excellent book on yojijukugo is "Kanji Idoims." from the "Power Japanese" series:

https://openlibrary.org/works/OL27733147W/Kanji_idioms?editi...


That last bit resonates with me so much! In fact, there’s a word in Japanese for it - ‘tsundoku’! Ever since I stumbled upon it, I feel almost vindicated :)).

Handy template: <Japanese name for doing something>, ancient Japanese technique/art of <doing something>.

For example:

Aruku, ancient Japanese technique of moving around. Written as ?? and literally meaning 'walk' is movement of feet Japanese have perfected over thousands of years.


So like Japanese "ganbatte"

English: "strive!"


Sharing some Korean Yojijukugos (originating from China)

????(????) wii rok ji ma

To point at a deer and call it a horse. Used for suck ups who says agrees to things that are clearly not right.

????(????) ub cham ma sok

To behead Ma Su (name) while crying. In the Romance of Three Kingdoms, Zhuge Liang had to behead his favourite general Ma Su as he wept because Ma Su ignored the given command resulting in losing the war. This is used when you have to be fair for the greater good.

There are also fake yojijukugos which were created on online forums. These are not based on Chinese characters but made by taking letters from Korean phrases. But they caught on because they kinda sound like real yojijikugos :D

???? nae ro nam bul

Romance for me, but adultery for you. Used for people who are lenient to themselves but strict to others.

???? ja gang doo cheon

Fight of two strong-sprited geniuses. Used when two strong characters butt head with each other.


I recommend glancing at a Japanese dictionary sometime.

Many (but not all) Japanese four-character idioms (yojijukugo) are actually Chinese imports, and they're IMHO far more prevalent in that language.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chengyu

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yojijukugo


There are words that better express the nuances of the Japanese terms:

Jishin–(self-assured-ness) ii kanji–(feels right) yasashii kanji–(nice to someone) atama ga ii–(smart)


> Kaizen and Ikigai comes to mind.

I can understand that though - without the translation, the terms become more specific in English usage. Take Kaizen, or Continuous Improvement. Specifically using the Japanese term shows what sort of continuous improvement you're doing. I notice, however, that it's also apparently a trademark....


Oh nice! I feel like Japan has the best words. I'll add this one in. Interesting that the gender was specified.

> > "Sajeonogi," or "Knocked down four times, rising up five."

> Is Korean really that much more efficient than English, or is that word a label?

No, it's a ???? (sajasongoh), or 4 character idiom. They originally come from Chinese, in which they're called chéngyu (?? or ??, in simplified and traditional characters, respectively), meaning "set phrase", and also exist in Japanese, in which they're called ???? (yojijukugo, literally "four character Chinese idiom").

Because of their origin in classical Chinese and their brevity, they're impossible to understand unless they're explained to you. In Asian countries, memorizing/understanding these proverbs is a big part of schooling.

I don't know the details of this particular sajasongoh, but I'm guessing that it either comes from classical Chinese or is a modified version of one that does. Modifying these proverbs to fit a particular situation is a common form of wordplay in Chinese, Japanese, and Korean. For example, the Chosun Ilbo (a big Korean newspaper) loves doing this in their headlines.


Oh yeah you're probably right about that. Good work. By the way, any suggestions on that phrase? I'm not a native speaker so my Japanese isn't very good.

> I miss Japanese. :-(

?????!

(I assume the downvoter wants a translation? It means "do your best!" [on your startup])


In Japanese.

I like the idea of finding micro-habits, activities and relationships that are fulfilling.

While Ikigai may have been repurposed by the West, its new incarnation and Venn diagram seems like a pretty valuable tool for young people to navigate life, even if it's a radical semantic shift from the original Japanese. It also has the merit of trying to awaken peoples' ambition, to raise the ceiling on what they think they might achieve, and how to get there, which Anne-Marie's originalism lacks.

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